MA Gun Grab 2024: H.4885 - Passed legislature, headed to the governor

[Coyote33]

The rest of us are actually libertarians, not far right wing conservative republicans. We want to live our lives as we see fit, not run everyone else's lives. And as long as we're being largely left alone, we just go about our business. So we don't fight until cornered.

Great points! The libertarians always have to have it to the nth extreme. I'd much rather consider a "Libertarian Lite", where freedom abounds in all areas, but not so absolute, full bore, all the time. They need to look at the bigger picture, and how to attain basic goals before "all at once".

The millions of military age criminal aliens pouring across the border that the Enclave is pushing to put in police and military uniforms along with the purging of the police and military of patriots means .gov will have the ability to field large force of trigger pullers with zero love or loyalty towards Americans. And that's on top of the technological surveillance state and whatever nightmarish drone/AI warfare is getting cooked up by DARPA and the tech oligarchs right now.

What is this "enclave" you're referencing here?

We could always get a jump on them. But no one will.

You first. ;-)

 

[Waher]

What is this "enclave" you're referencing here?

Fictional retro-futuristic 1950s Deep State in the Fallout post apocalyptic videogame universe devised in 1997 that's turned out to be a relatively accurate depiction of the current US Government.

 

[mothybee]

My opinion?

Republicans underestimate democrats. Liberal democrats aren't dumb. They just hold different beliefs than we do. Some of the hardest working and smartest people I know are liberal democrats. True believers. Zealots. They were pissed when Clinton's '94 ban didn't actually ban the things they wanted gone. They were pissed when that law sunset. They were pissed when Trump "stole" the office from Hillary then nominated conservatives to the Supreme Court. So they huddled up and analyzed their failures, figured out where they needed to improve, and came up with a plan.

Conservative republicans keep getting caught flat footed. And when they have the advantage, they both fail to use it effectively, and take actions that please far right wing conservatives but piss off everybody else, which causes them to get unelected.

The rest of us are actually libertarians, not far right wing conservative republicans. We want to live our lives as we see fit, not run everyone else's lives. And as long as we're being largely left alone, we just go about our business. So we don't fight until cornered.

Well, consider yourself cornered.

 

[Rob Boudrie]

The rest of us are actually libertarians, not far right wing conservative republicans. We want to live our lives as we see fit, not run everyone else's lives. And as long as we're being largely left alone, we just go about our business. So we don't fight until cornered.

Rs also have issues with running other people's lives - they just choose different aspects of life they feel they hold the moral high ground on and thus have a mission to make decisions for those who do not share their values. Too bad L's have no chance to get elected except in small local elections.

 

[p..]

Rs also have issues with running other people's lives - they just choose different aspects of life they feel they hold the moral high ground on and thus have a mission to make decisions for those who do not share their values.

I agree. And that's how they get unelected. The Roe vs Wade reversal probably cost Trump the reelection. Half the population had laser beams coming out of their eyes over that, so we got Obama's third term. That kind of shortsightedness thwarts long range tactics because they piss off too many people and don't just lose the majority, they lose the majority to a bunch of really fired up opponents.

Too bad L's have no chance to get elected except in small local elections.

Any third party. I'd write in Ron Paul for 2024 if it weren't just throwing away a vote.

 

[Rob Boudrie]

I agree. And that's how they get unelected. The Roe vs Wade reversal probably cost Trump the reelection. Half the population had laser beams coming out of their eyes over that, so we got Obama's third term. That kind of shortsightedness thwarts long range tactics because they piss off too many people and don't just lose the majority, they lose the majority to a bunch of really fired up opponents.


Any third party. I'd write in Ron Paul for 2024 if it weren't just throwing away a vote.

It is not throwing away a vote in the DPRM since it is a given Trump will not take this state.

 

[CMEBoston]

The millions of military age criminal aliens pouring across the border that the Enclave is pushing to put in police and military uniforms along with the purging of the police and military of patriots means .gov will have the ability to field large force of trigger pullers with zero love or loyalty towards Americans. And that's on top of the technological surveillance state and whatever nightmarish drone/AI warfare is getting cooked up by DARPA and the tech oligarchs right now.

so it may be a fair fight then got it

 

[HorizontalHunter]

It is not throwing away a vote in the DPRM since it is a given Trump will not take this state.

Beat me to it.

 

[Ron Jablonski]

I wish there was a party for "I just wanna be left alone"

 

[Toast]

I agree. And that's how they get unelected. The Roe vs Wade reversal probably cost Trump the reelection. Half the population had laser beams coming out of their eyes over that, so we got Obama's third term.

I do believe that Roe was reversed 19 months after the election, and so likely had a lesser effect on Biden's election.

 

[Joeldiaz]

I do believe that Roe was reversed 19 months after the election, and so likely had a lesser effect on Biden's election.

Yeah what more than likely cost Trump the election was COVID.

 

[FalArAk]

Yeah what more than likely cost Trump the election was COVID.

What cost Trump the election was ironically, Trump.

Dude just can't STFU when he needs to and let everyone else step on their own dick.

Media played a part in it as well.

 

[Picton]

I wish there was a party for "I just wanna be left alone"

There was.

Then people decided they were tired of living in Territories and applied for statehood. Downhill ever since.

 

[TLB]

What costs Trump the election was ironically, Trump.

Dude just can't STFU when he needs to and let everyone else step on their own dick.

Media played a part in it as well.

There is no way the conspirators that were trying to bring him down (the deep state, the media, and big tech) were going to leave him alone if he was quiet. They attacked him from day one in 2015.

Thankfully, they appear to be overplaying their hand this time around.

 

[waehrik]

View attachment 856745

It's the same thing as the republicans - didn't want to do anything about the border problems and voted down the bill because they want to keep everyone mad. They don't want to solve problems, just get votes and power.

 

[TLB]

It's the same thing as healthy republicans didn't want to do anything about the border problems and voted down the bill because they want to keep everyone mad. They don't want to solve problems, just get votes and power.

The Rs suck and do that all the time (see lack of Obamacare repeal), but in this case the border bill was a steaming pile of unnecessary crap. Also, the border was under control before Biden undid everything that was being done under Trump.

 

[Coyote33]

border bill was a steaming pile of unnecessary crap

We've had border rules all along. Why not follow the rules? Seemed to work fine in the 70's and 80's to do things right.

 

[71montess]

It's the same thing as healthy republicans didn't want to do anything about the border problems and voted down the bill because they want to keep everyone mad. They don't want to solve problems, just get votes and power.

You can't be serious?

 

[waehrik]

The Rs suck and do that all the time (see lack of Obamacare repeal), but in this case the border bill was a steaming pile of unnecessary crap. Also, the border was under control before Biden undid everything that was being done under Trump.

I agree, but they also haven't posed any solutions. And they've come out and said that they want to keep problems existing so they can campaign on them in the fall. It's bullshit that they don't want to solve problems just so they can keep their base mad.

It doesn't help any of us that many of their main goal is to oppose everything the Democrats want. Most of the Dems platform is bad, sure, but not all of it. And there's a lot of good they could do if they weren't so focused on being obstructionist to everything.

 

[not new guy]

Every thread is an out yourself thread if you wait long enough.

 

[Picton]

And they've come out and said that they want to keep problems existing so they can campaign on them in the fall. It's bullshit that they don't want to solve problems just so they can keep their base mad.

I've seen that coverage as well, though no direct quotes. It makes sense, and both parties do it.

Why would Trump, as the future nominee, want the border to be "fixed" right now, under Biden's watch? Politically, it makes FAR more sense for him to back Mitch off. The real question will be what happens (if anything) once Trump gets back into office. He was effective on the border last time, largely because of his rhetoric and his executive actions, but I'm not sure I see him pushing for a permanent solution in congress during (I hope) his second term.

Time will tell. Hopefully.

 

[CMEBoston]

I wish there was a party for "I just wanna be left alone"

I was naive once too

 

[pastera]

We are going to be completely frucked, this was their exact plan, have the house and senate disagree so they can put a committee together and "reconcile" the two bills behind closed doors.

Both bills were the framework to ban all semiautomatic firearms, so it's just arguing over how fast their gone.

The closer to the house bill the final result come out the better chance of a fast track to SCOTUS.

 

[pastera]

When they announced hd4420 I called Lovely's office to voice my opposition and was told by her staffer that she's a gun owner. That might not make a difference in how she feels about this trash legislation but it can't hurt to contact her office and put the pressure on. Creem is a lost cause.

The "I'm a gun owner" BS is their line for "go away plebe"

If you hear this it 95% of the time it means they are going to screw you hard.

 

[pastera]

I agree. And that's how they get unelected. The Roe vs Wade reversal probably cost Trump the reelection. Half the population had laser beams coming out of their eyes over that, so we got Obama's third term. That kind of shortsightedness thwarts long range tactics because they piss off too many people and don't just lose the majority, they lose the majority to a bunch of really fired up opponents.

So we should sit back and do nothing, especially major moves, because the squishy center might might give things back to the left to make major moves against us.
The left makes major moves every time and we just let them so we aren't called out as racist extremists.
Keep letting them own the narrative.

 

[Palladin]

The "I'm a gun owner" BS is their line for "go away plebe"

If you hear this it 95% of the time it means they are going to screw you hard.

Rosenthal's favorite line.."I'm a gun owner "

 

[not new guy]

It’s just an attempt to look like they respect the constitution to validate their clearly anti-2A position. It’s the equivalent of “I’m not a racist, I have a black friend.”

 

[Picton]

It’s just an attempt to validate their position as being reasonable. It’s the equivalent of “im not a racist, I have a black friend.”

"I support veterans. My cousin was in the Army."

"I understand what inflation is doing to families. I bought gas once."

"Yes, college is too expensive. I know firsthand how hard it is. I graduated from the University of Delaware in 1965."

Politicians on both sides love that kind of line.

 

[VTski4x4]

One more for the people in the back.

F*ck you, NO!

 

[p..]

So we should sit back and do nothing, especially major moves, because the squishy center might might give things back to the left to make major moves against us.
The left makes major moves every time and we just let them so we aren't called out as racist extremists.
Keep letting them own the narrative.

I'm not making my point very well. I'm not saying sit back and do nothing. I'm saying focus on the long game. And to play the long game, you have to stay in power.