MA Gun Grab 2024: H.4885 - Passed legislature, headed to the governor

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HARRYM said:
Seriously. If you understand taxes you understand that the amount you get back from charitable contributions is very small. The Trump Tax cuts put real cash in middle class Americans pockets.

And sadly I have come to accept that many in this country never grasped the reality of what America would look like today had Hillary won.

This is why the Left has gone scorched earth on America. They were on the verge of taking over and Trump messed things up. They will do anything to keep it from happening a second time.

But, for some, getting an extra 10 bucks back on their tax return eclipses the bigger picture.
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Yeah maybe it would have been difficult to double the standard deduction and retain charitable giving with the standard deduction in the tax code I don’t know. And I understand he was going after NYers with huge mortgage write offs. I’m ok with all that.

But it’s not like he fixed the tax code, it’s still 8000 pages long.
 
Asaltweapon said:
It’s not the 10 bucks.

It’s the system. Flat tax is a much more fair system anyway. 10% to somebody earning 100k then looking around to see big money earners paying the same amount because ‘deductions’ is a kick in the balls no matter how you slice it.

Don’t get me wrong. Trump has another huge battle coming when he wins again.
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Yeah the tax system seems like just a giant buffet of special interest handouts.

Just think of how much money we’d save with a 1 page tax code. We’d have 100,000 spare IRS employees we could put to work in the fast food business.
 
Woodsloafer said:
I would like to add to what you stated that it is my understanding that the NRA does not want to take the lead on any MA cases and prefers to support/work in the "background" because they do not want it to become an NRA "thing" in MA due to the liberal/Dem craziness here.
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Is there a good reason for a MA resident to donate to the NRA vs directly to Comm2A or GOAL?

Before I really understood (well at least as well as I do) MA gun politics and NRA internal shenanigans, I bought an NRA lifetime membership, but that was over 10 years ago and I haven't given them any money since. Maybe 5 years ago I just asked them to stop mailing me stuff and stop calling which they have mostly done.

I want to apply my time and effort well, but I am frustrated by the lack of transparency in... many things.
 
p.. said:
Is there a good reason for a MA resident to donate to the NRA vs directly to Comm2A or GOAL?

Before I really understood (well at least as well as I do) MA gun politics and NRA internal shenanigans, I bought an NRA lifetime membership, but that was over 10 years ago and I haven't given them any money since. Maybe 5 years ago I just asked them to stop mailing me stuff and stop calling.

I want to apply my time and effort well, but I am frustrated by the lack of transparency in... many things.
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Personally, I don't believe so, I would/do donate to GOAL or Comm2A; however, I have been a member of the NRA for 35+ years and will continue to be. I typically don't send extra money to the NRA (again, better to GOAL or Comm2A for us in MA) but also believe that they have some importance in the national gun rights fight (I do not believe that GOAL and Comm2A are in DC fighting legislation there every day like the NRA). I have been told, not sure if it is true, that the NRA has spent more in MA over the years than it gets in money/memberships from the state. I just feel that we should support organizations fighting on all levels.
 
BillyBass said:
If people spent 1/20th of their time calling/emailing their reps/senators, showing up for hearings or doing something useful other than posting on a forum this may have had a slight chance of not moving forward. Going online and ranting about it after the fact does absolutely nothing other than make people feel better.

You reap what you sow.....................
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Do you dress like a clown too? If you believe that any of this actually matters in this state then you’re as dumb as your name sake wall mounted fish. What a ridiculously naive take.
 
Woodsloafer said:
I would like to add to what you stated that it is my understanding that the NRA does not want to take the lead on any MA cases and prefers to support/work in the "background" because they do not want it to become an NRA "thing" in MA due to the liberal/Dem craziness here.
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Oh, is that why? I thought it was because they have simply been stealing our money for decades and haven’t done a single meaningful thing to reverse the nearly constant cascade of constitutional infringement. I will not send the NRA one more red cent. All they do is spend it on lavish travel and events for their hack leadership, oh but they send you a nylon gym bag big enough for one sneaker that cost them $3 to have made in China so you’re on board right? As Rick Pitino once said “the NRA isn’t walking through that door.” They could care less about us, it’s about them. If they did they would be leading the charge on the RI magazine issue, the IL registration issue and this abomination of a law, but crickets. Great parties at the SHOT Show though.
 
Taipan01 said:
I'll throw the curve ball. Because they have nothing else to anchor it to by way of backdating. The 2016 edict, not law, put forth by Healy in her interpretation "what the 1994 AWB really means (to me)", though millions of people, LE's, judicial's, the hot dog guy at Fenway were in agreement as to what it meant but were in error as she is truly remarkable, truly, almost omnipotent, just ask her. I did, she said it was so. In reality (mine anyway), everything manufactured forward including today that meets the compliance criteria for the AWB should still be fine. The biggest reason some/most FFL's don't deal with it is because the state has bottomless pockets to use as a cudgel, ours, where mom and pop places squeak out a living. If that fails, send in the inspectors. There's more than one way to skin a cat, at least according to Ho Lee Fuk's cookbook Roadside Cuisine (his motto is Remington or radials, meats all the same). Making something illegal that was legal is going to be a hard sell when the rubber hits the road, squirrel, chipmunk, groundhog, etc., If it does move forward, I believe all things prior would be grandfathered.

You know, it's okay to be apprehensive, nervous, unsure, even frightened at times about what the possibilities may hold in the future. All's that really matters is what you do with it.
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It is blatantly obvious that all of this is intended to infringe on your rights.

The Bruen case rocked these anti-gun control freaks back on their heels and here we are, but they know they can hold up the process in the courts for years and keep unconstitutional laws in place to keep you terrified of the consequences. You can see how well this works with the Healey July 2016 opinion that wasn't a law. There are ways to get what you want, but requires some effort that a lot of owners aren't willing to do.

Their control scheme is destroyed with this ruling...if they followed it.

This way they can enact a quasi-ban that will scare everyone, hoping for maybe a better ruling in the future to make it permanent.

The next presidential election is more important than you think (more than getting FJB out of office). There could be two maybe three retirements in the Supreme Court in the next 5 years.

Thomas is 74, Alito is 72 and Sotomayor is 68. Replacing the two conservative members with liberals (depending on the president) could swing firearm cases in the wrong direction for gun owners for years.
 
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btnh6668 said:
Not everyone has the money to buy what they want at any time. So of there has been a gun/frame on someones list that they have been saving for, now is the time to get it.
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Understood and understood if your not gonna be a pantshitter if they 2016 backfxck it....

But you and I know there will be people buying today, and the forum will be full of posts......"what do I do now with my recently aquired lower that has been made illegal?"
 
Retsambew said:
Oh, is that why? I thought it was because they have simply been stealing our money for decades and haven’t done a single meaningful thing to reverse the nearly constant cascade of constitutional infringement. I will not send the NRA one more red cent. All they do is spend it on lavish travel and events for their hack leadership, oh but they send you a nylon gym bag big enough for one sneaker that cost them $3 to have made in China so you’re on board right? As Rick Pitino once said “the NRA isn’t walking through that door.” They could care less about us, it’s about them. If they did they would be leading the charge on the RI magazine issue, the IL registration issue and this abomination of a law, but crickets. Great parties at the SHOT Show though.
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The only entity we can hope will help us is the SCOTUS, we've all called our Senators and Reps, given money to GOAL and the NRA, and look where it's gotten us. Worse off than we were before.
 
Mark from MA said:
Understood and understood if your not gonna be a pantshitter if they 2016 backfxck it....

But you and I know there will be people buying today, and the forum will be full of posts......"what do I do now with my recently aquired lower that has been made illegal?"
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Lowers right now are legal. The final bill will have what has been legal grandfathered in… Or it will crash and burn in any court due to factual non- compliance (not to be mistaken with “blatant” which is harder and longer to prove.

Relax folks. The fcukery is still ahead.
 
Kurtz said:
The only entity we can hope will help us is the SCOTUS, we've all called our Senators and Reps, given money to GOAL and the NRA, and look where it's gotten us. Worse off than we were before.
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Yup, could have spent a zillion dollars here fighting these bills, held a hundred rallies with thousands of people, and they still would have passed them. The only hope is the court system/SCOTUS after their passage and that is where the money needs to be donated/spent, IMO. The Senate didn't even allow any public hearings/discussions, that's how tainted the system is here as far as gun rights.
 
Devils Paintbrush said:
It is blatantly obvious that all of this is intended to infringe on your rights.

The Bruen case rocked these anti-gun control freaks back on their heels and here we are, but they know they can hold up the process in the courts for years and keep unconstitutional laws in place to keep you terrified of the consequences. You can see how well this works with the Healey July 2016 opinion that wasn't a law. There are ways to get what you want, but requires some effort that a lot of owners aren't willing to do.

Their control scheme is destroyed with this ruling...if they followed it.

This way they can enact a quasi-ban that will scare everyone, hoping for maybe a better ruling in the future to make it permanent.

The next presidential election is more important than you think (more than getting FJB out of office). There could be two maybe three retirements in the Supreme Court in the next 5 years.

Thomas is 74, Alito is 72 and Sotomayor is 68. Replacing the two conservative members with liberals (depending on the president) could swing firearm cases in the wrong direction for gun owners for years.
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There are progressive groups actively pushing Sotomayor to retire now.
 
HARRYM said:

GOAL - MA Assault Weapon Court Action

goal.org goal.org

I have a serious and an honest question. I have lost count of how many time I have posted the many cases where the NRA backed local organizations with financial and legal help. Many, many, many times. Yet many, many times you ignore it. Would you be offended if I asked you to take off your charter member NRA Bashing hat just for one minute and explain to me why it is you have ignored the MANY cases of the NRA helping local organizations, including GOAL?

And my question is being sincerely asked here.

Thanks

Harry M.
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This last example was a good one.

The rest, I must have missed.
 
Roadglide said:
Not to side track but the Clay and Buck show yesterday did an on air poll of who was more desirable, I think was the phrasing, Hillary or Kamala. Kamala won hands down [rofl]
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Oh, TLH (The Laughing Hyena) would have been a hoot... as recently as 10-15 years ago- no doubt. While cankers has always had the sexual alure of a dumptruck...
 
Devils Paintbrush said:
It is blatantly obvious that all of this is intended to infringe on your rights.

The Bruen case rocked these anti-gun control freaks back on their heels and here we are, but they know they can hold up the process in the courts for years and keep unconstitutional laws in place to keep you terrified of the consequences. You can see how well this works with the Healey July 2016 opinion that wasn't a law. There are ways to get what you want, but requires some effort that a lot of owners aren't willing to do.

Their control scheme is destroyed with this ruling...if they followed it.

This way they can enact a quasi-ban that will scare everyone, hoping for maybe a better ruling in the future to make it permanent.

The next presidential election is more important than you think (more than getting FJB out of office). There could be two maybe three retirements in the Supreme Court in the next 5 years.

Thomas is 74, Alito is 72 and Sotomayor is 68. Replacing the two conservative members with liberals (depending on the president) could swing firearm cases in the wrong direction for gun owners for years.
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Yabut,

My reply that you quoted was a response to why the years 1994, 2016 and 2024 are being co-mingled, mangled, throughout the proposals.
 
Kurtz said:
The only entity we can hope will help us is the SCOTUS, we've all called our Senators and Reps, given money to GOAL and the NRA, and look where it's gotten us. Worse off than we were before.
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Except that very likely more than half of the gun owners haven't called their reps and senators. Havent given money to GOAL and the most important of all......did NOT vote.
 
btnh6668 said:
Except that very likely more than half of the gun owners haven't called their reps and senators. Havent given money to GOAL and the most important of all......did NOT vote.
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100%. Most gun owners couldn't be bothered. I remember back during the Obama years, being in a packed gun store after attending a gun rally in Boston (where about 30 of us showed up), and one of the guys there asked everyone that was panic buying why they all weren't at the rally, "we had to work", then they were asked if they were GOAL members, "what's GOAL?" was the response, then they were asked if they vote, "no, our vote doesn't count in this state".
 
Reading the GOAL summary of the "greatly expanded" Red Flag laws is jaw dropping. Who can file, basically anyone. This is where 'the man' gets an uninvited Mass State pass to enter into your house without a warrant search and seize all your firearms enter your house and look for non-compliance. I could tell you from hard experience that the court is willing to accept anything that the PoPo say is non-compliant, and you will be charged accordingly. In my case a .17HMR Volquartsen target rifle was quoted in court to be an assault rifle. I encourage you all to read the GOAL Red Flag summary very carefully.

 
1911rnr said:
100%. Most gun owners couldn't be bothered. I remember back during the Obama years, being in a packed gun store after attending a gun rally in Boston (where about 30 of us showed up), and one of the guys there asked everyone that was panic buying why they all weren't at the rally, "we had to work", then they were asked if they were GOAL members, "what's GOAL?" was the response, then they were asked if they vote, "no, our vote doesn't count in this state".
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I completely get that though.
Unless you're scouring emails, going to gun clubs weekly, or doing your own research, it's VERY difficult to know what's going on with these new bills.

People are busy working and tending to their own lives. The way our government is getting these things through is by taking advantage of this very mechanism. Every new bill should be posted in multiple newspapers and journals for months to allow time for it to disseminate through to all constituents before it even gets to the floor for voting. There needs to be a mechanism for busy working people to have their voices heard and votes counted without having to take time off of work. Our democracy is a farse right now. "let's pass bills secretly that nobody can contest because we're sitting here feeding off the taxpayers dollars while they work and we can go completely unchecked". That should be illegal.
 
Rat187 said:
Reading the GOAL summary of the "greatly expanded" Red Flag laws is jaw dropping. Who can file, basically anyone. This is where 'the man' gets an uninvited Mass State pass to enter into your house without a warrant search and seize all your firearms enter your house and look for non-compliance. I could tell you from hard experience that the court is willing to accept anything that the PoPo say is non-compliant, and you will be charged accordingly. In my case a .17HMR Volquartsen target rifle was quoted in court to be an assault rifle. I encourage you all to read the GOAL Red Flag summary very carefully.

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I’m waiting for one mom, or group of moms, to try to red flag all gun owners because they make her/them feel unsafe and threatened. Or for somebody to leak the list of LTC owners so they can pick through the list.
 
Broc said:
This last example was a good one.

The rest, I must have missed.
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Some of my best was how deeply involved the NRA was involved in Heller case as well a Bruen, And the NY rifle and Pistol clubs letter thanking the NRA after the Bruen decision.

Never once have I posted the NRA is perfect, nor will I.
 
not new guy said:
I’m waiting for one mom, or group of moms, to try to red flag all gun owners because they make her/them feel unsafe and threatened. Or for somebody to leak the list of LTC owners so they can pick through the list.
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Didn't a Mass list get leaked accidentally about a year ago?
 
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