New Beretta AX-160 / AX-100 .223 / multi caliber carbine

soloman02 said:
Meh.

I built my AR, with Eotech for $1450. It isn't piston or ambi but it was $650 less, which means $650 to spend on ammo and mags for the same price. Or I could go out and buy a piston AR from Ruger for about $1100-$1200 and with Eotech still have $500-$600 for ammo and mags.

IMHO, if I'm am going to spend $2000 on a rifle, its gonna be for a "Battle Rifle," which means .308 caliber. So an M1A or AR-10.
Click to expand...
I couldn't agree more.
 
Meh, looks like a super soaker or a nerf gun. Let me know when these are available.

IMG_7229.jpg
 
PaulD said:
I'd rather have a Tavor.
Click to expand...
Why? It's got a horrible trigger and sub-par accuracy. Yes it might be the new cool thing but no way in hell I would even pay $1500 for one. (Plus I don't care for bullpups). This new beretta is cheaper, has a better trigger and better accuracy. This rifle is one of the reasons that I got rid of my ACR. I'd love to have this rifle in 7.62x39. Nice and cheap to shoot and uses cheap as hell Ak mags. What's not to love?
 
rcwhat said:
Why? It's got a horrible trigger and sub-par accuracy. Yes it might be the new cool thing but no way in hell I would even pay $1500 for one. (Plus I don't care for bullpups). This new beretta is cheaper, has a better trigger and better accuracy. This rifle is one of the reasons that I got rid of my ACR. I'd love to have this rifle in 7.62x39. Nice and cheap to shoot and uses cheap as hell Ak mags. What's not to love?
Click to expand...

Better accuracy according to whom? Also, if you're that concerned with accuracy, why do you want 7.62x39 (which isn't exactly known for accuracy or shooting flat)? All the reviews I've seen say accuracy is very good (1 MOA with ammo it likes) and I've seen no reviews for the Beretta that talk about how accurate it is. Yes, bullpup triggers are generally not so great but the Tavor's is the best of the bunch. However, the Tavor's trigger can be improved quite a bit with an easy modification, and I'm betting some polishing in the trigger group will make it even better.

Why do I want a Tavor? Because it's the shortest rifle you can get without going to an SBR, it's currently the most battle proven 5.56 rifle out there, short of the AR/M4/M16 platform.

I already have an XCR and I'm not seeing how the ARX would do anything better than that, other than support from the factory of course.
 
PaulD said:
Why?
Click to expand...


Reliability and aftermarket parts. FN, like HK, has been known to have higher prices becuase "name brand". SCAR's are nice, but the price of the gun + aftermarket parts is dumb. ACR has had minor reliability issues.
 
Gman021 said:
Reliability and aftermarket parts. FN, like HK, has been known to have higher prices becuase "name brand". SCAR's are nice, but the price of the gun + aftermarket parts is dumb. ACR has had minor reliability issues.
Click to expand...

With all due respect to LWRC, from a reliability perspective, I think I'd trust FN first. I agree that FN has a bit too much of the HK attitude though.
 
PaulD said:
Better accuracy according to whom? Also, if you're that concerned with accuracy, why do you want 7.62x39 (which isn't exactly known for accuracy or shooting flat)? All the reviews I've seen say accuracy is very good (1 MOA with ammo it likes) and I've seen no reviews for the Beretta that talk about how accurate it is. Yes, bullpup triggers are generally not so great but the Tavor's is the best of the bunch. However, the Tavor's trigger can be improved quite a bit with an easy modification, and I'm betting some polishing in the trigger group will make it even better.

Why do I want a Tavor? Because it's the shortest rifle you can get without going to an SBR, it's currently the most battle proven 5.56 rifle out there, short of the AR/M4/M16 platform.

I already have an XCR and I'm not seeing how the ARX would do anything better than that, other than support from the factory of course.
Click to expand...
Gun Review: IWI TAVOR SAR | The Truth About GunsThe Truth About Guns
every review says how the trigger sucks and there are mixed reviews about its accuracy. Everything I've seen on the beretta has been very positive. How do you like the Xcr? That's what I initially wanted when I bought the ACR. I honestly don't feel that 7.62x39 is anywhere as bad accuracy wise as some people on this forum make it out to be. I have no problem hitting the 200yd plate 30 times in 30 shots with my sa-85m ak with iron sights. Are my ARs more accurate, yes a tiny bit, but I enjoy shooting 7.62x39 more.
 
Last edited:
rcwhat said:
Gun Review: IWI TAVOR SAR | The Truth About GunsThe Truth About Guns
every review says how the trigger sucks and there are mixed reviews about its accuracy. Everything I've seen on the beretta has been very positive. How do you like the Xcr? That's what I initially wanted when I bought the ACR. I honestly don't feel that 7.62x39 is anywhere as bad accuracy wise as some people on this forum make it out to be. I have no problem hitting the 200yd plate 30 times in 30 shots with my sa-85m ak with iron sights. Are my ARs more accurate, yes a tiny bit, but I enjoy shooting 7.62x39 more.
Click to expand...

Go to youtube and watch the reviews of the Tavor on there by Military Arms Channel and others. They're getting 1MOA with some ammo. I'll try to find you some tomorrow. Also, Military Arms Channel has a video on improving the Tavor's trigger. I simply haven't seen any reviews on the Beretta where they actually shoot it. If you have some, please link because I'd like to read/watch them.

As for the XCR, I think it's a great design. The trigger (2nd gen, 1st gen trigger sucked) is as good as the Geissele ssa in my AR. The ergonomics are great and it feeds everything I've put through it. The only problem I've had is that it doesn't like some 20 round USGI mags. For whatever reason, a lot of 20 round mags seem to angle the round slightly down. The XCR has a problem feeding from these and it will ram the bullet back into the cartridge in some cases. If I didn't live in this craphole of a state, it wouldn't be a problem as the only 20 rounders I'd have would be PMAGs. I've never had this problem with USGI 30 rounders. The only other problem with the XCR isn't with the rifle itself, but with the company. Their support sucks. I keep hoping a company like Springfield Armory will buy Robinson.
 
Thanks Paul for the short review on the XCR. Now that I think of it, I'm pretty sure we talked before about the Xcr and Acr when I was looking to buy last year. I really wanted the Xcr but finding one was impossible.

I have seen some reviews and videos of the beretta, I'll try to find them and post them up.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sVxWaqKAQ6M

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=20q2Iw94N28

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uWk19fWzKQc

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SGS2WAF2oAo

http://www.gunsandammo.com/reviews/citizen-soldier-beretta-arx-100-review/
 
Last edited:
PaulD said:
With all due respect to LWRC, from a reliability perspective, I think I'd trust FN first. I agree that FN has a bit too much of the HK attitude though.
Click to expand...

The difference between the ARX and the SCAR, LWRC, ACR, and others is that the ARX is in full scale mass production and is the standard issue arm of a First World army (Italy).
 
PaulD said:
As for the XCR, I think it's a great design. The trigger (2nd gen, 1st gen trigger sucked) is as good as the Geissele ssa in my AR. The ergonomics are great and it feeds everything I've put through it. The only problem I've had is that it doesn't like some 20 round USGI mags. For whatever reason, a lot of 20 round mags seem to angle the round slightly down. The XCR has a problem feeding from these and it will ram the bullet back into the cartridge in some cases. If I didn't live in this craphole of a state, it wouldn't be a problem as the only 20 rounders I'd have would be PMAGs. I've never had this problem with USGI 30 rounders. The only other problem with the XCR isn't with the rifle itself, but with the company. Their support sucks. I keep hoping a company like Springfield Armory will buy Robinson.
Click to expand...


I forgot about the XCR. Great design and ergonomics.
 
vellnueve said:
The difference between the ARX and the SCAR, LWRC, ACR, and others is that the ARX is in full scale mass production and is the standard issue arm of a First World army (Italy).
Click to expand...

This. It's one reason I want a Tavor... one of the most capable and battle-tested armies in the world designed and fielded it from the ground up, even though there were numerous other designs they could have adopted.

Same goes for the SCAR-H... SOCOM fielded-tested them in the Sandbox and decided to order them so FN must have done something right.
 
rcwhat said:
Thanks Paul for the short review on the XCR. Now that I think of it, I'm pretty sure we talked before about the Xcr and Acr when I was looking to buy last year. I really wanted the Xcr but finding one was impossible.

I have seen some reviews and videos of the beretta, I'll try to find them and post them up.

Beretta ARX 100 - YouTube

First Look at the Beretta ARX100 - YouTube

At the Range: Beretta ARX100 - YouTube

Beretta ARX-160 Modular Assault Rifle/Carbine/SBR Demo Video SOFIC 2011 - YouTube

Citizen Soldier: Beretta ARX 100 Review - Guns & Ammo
Click to expand...

Thanks. I'll look at these a little later and yeah, I remember talking about the XCR.

Don't get me wrong, the Beretta does seem like a very cool design in many ways. It's not beautiful but who cares. A Glock isn't beautiful either until you realize it's still working after 50k rounds. If I didn't already have the XCR I'd probably be a lot more interested in it.

vellnueve said:
The difference between the ARX and the SCAR, LWRC, ACR, and others is that the ARX is in full scale mass production and is the standard issue arm of a First World army (Italy).
Click to expand...

That's a fair point and part of why I want a Tavor.
 
I think I may have seen one of those at a LGS, but did not know what it was. I was told it would most likely not be workable in MA. This is because the stock needs to be folded to allow for disassembly, but would have to be pinned for MA compliance so do the math.
 
I don't understand why people focus on the trigger so much. An AR with a match grade trigger us primarily for long range accuracy and consistency. The Tavor is primarily a CQB battle rifle that can also hit stuff at range if necessary. Although it is more challenging because of the trigger, which is designed to always work in a harsh environment. If you are shooting targets less than 50-100 yards or less (its primary purpose) you will still hit it with the heavier trigger. It isn't a match grade target rifle, so why compare it to one?


PaulD said:
Ok, here are some reviews on the Tavor.

This one shows accuracy at about 13:10. With the right ammo, it gets to 1MOA though it's definitely ammo dependent. He also talks about the trigger being an issue:
Tavor Review: Water Submergence Test & Accuracy - YouTube

In this one he retries for accuracy with a lightened trigger, and talks about how to lighten the trigger:
Tavor Update: Accuracy & Trigger Pull Weight - YouTube
Click to expand...



Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using Tapatalk 2
 


Don't think this will sell well in Mass unless they figure out a way to field strip the rifle without having to fold the stock. It also doesn't work with a lot of different mags
 
Last edited by a moderator:
Vagrant said:


Don't think this will sell well in Mass unless they figure out a way to field strip the rifle without having to fold the stock. It also doesn't work with a lot of different mags
Click to expand...


This. Most likely will never be able to modify it into MA compliant form because of the folding stock/field strip combo. I highly doubt Beretta gives two shits about the few states they can't sell it in. They're not going to go through the cost of redesigning it for field strip in AWB states.

Besides...$2000 for that cheap plastic thing and it only takes USGI mags? Go spend that money on a high end AR.
 
Last edited by a moderator:
frenchman said:
Reminds me of a SCAR that needs to hit the gym. I'm not sure if I like the front end.
Click to expand...

It looks tall and skinny. Don't like that either.


MrJones79 said:
This. Most likely will never be able to modify it into MA compliant form because of the folding stock/field strip combo. I highly doubt Beretta gives two shits about the few states they can't sell it in. They're not going to go through the cost of redesigning it for field strip in AWB states.

Besides...$2000 for that cheap plastic thing and it only takes USGI mags? Go spend that money on a high end AR.
Click to expand...


Why can't the stock just be pinned to make it AWB compliant? What would a quick change barrel have to do with anything?
 
Gman021 said:
It looks tall and skinny. Don't like that either.





Why can't the stock just be pinned to make it AWB compliant? What would a quick change barrel have to do with anything?
Click to expand...
when you field strip the rifle, you need to fold the stock to access the bolt. the BCG comes out of the back of the reciever.

sent using tapatalk
 
So darn bulky.

If I want a conventional carbine, I want one with a narrow handgrip that I can grip. Like this:

centurionrail.jpg
 
Gman021 said:
It looks tall and skinny. Don't like that either.





Why can't the stock just be pinned to make it AWB compliant? What would a quick change barrel have to do with anything?
Click to expand...

Dradian said:
when you field strip the rifle, you need to fold the stock to access the bolt. the BCG comes out of the back of the reciever.

sent using tapatalk
Click to expand...

Exactly. Can't access bolt with a pinned stock. No way this makes it to MA gun shops if I were to guess.
 

Similar threads

Best pistol caliber?
2 3 4
Replies
98
Views
1K
Agnotology
Agnotology
New AR10 upper build caliber?
Replies
23
Views
391
Golddiggie
Golddiggie
.223 Words of Advice?
3 4 5
Replies
126
Views
2K
dcmdon
dcmdon
Feeding problem with Henry 22LR lever carbine?
Replies
6
Views
178
walking wolf
W
223 load development
Replies
28
Views
314
Colt505
C
Back
Top Bottom