The Conference Committee has sent official language out - h.4885

[pastera]

The fact that is a lower priced firearm will make no difference if they go after him.

If you're speeding and get pulled over do you think they're going to let you go solely because you are driving a Kia instead of a Mercedes.

You are more likely to get a ticket in a shit box since it's assumed to be less capable of safe handling at excess speeds than a higher quality car designed to operate at the higher speeds normal on German highways

 

[pastera]

It reads like a contract that had 15 people write it, one at a time, and the guy previous was fired before the next started

reading the original bill it was clearly written by several authors and the attention to detail went south towards the end of the document indicating they were up against a deadline to have it ready

 

[DJBrad]

And every other drafter had an extra 21st chromosome.

Much regard.

 

[Broc Tuah]

Who's going to educate the cops on this law???

8 out of 10 didn't understand the existing gun laws

The cops are not law experts on any laws. They know the basics any monkey can learn in 20 minutes.

 

[HorizontalHunter]

It reads like a contract that had 15 drunk and stoned people write it, one at a time, and the guy previous was fired before the next started

Fixed it for ya.

 

[not new guy]

reading the original bill it was clearly written by several authors and the attention to detail went south towards the end of the document indicating they were up against a deadline to have it ready

It's painfully clear to me that they were in way over their heads when they were drafting it, and that they eventually just threw their hands up, spread their cheeks and plopped it down into the bowl. That laziness/incompetence will make for some interesting, expensive court cases in the coming years.

 

[HorizontalHunter]

The cops are not law experts on any laws. Theu know the basics any monkey can learn in 20 minutes.

This.

When in doubt they arrest and let the DA and court sort it out.

 

[Nightshift]

reading the original bill it was clearly written by several authors and the attention to detail went south towards the end of the document indicating they were up against a deadline to have it ready

Are you saying that the "Room Full of Monkeys" did not write Shakespeare?

 

[pastera]

It's painfully clear to me that they were in way over their heads when they were drafting it, and that they eventually just threw their hands up, spread their cheeks and plopped it down into the bowl. That laziness/incompetence will make for some interesting, expensive court cases in the coming years.

Which is also part of the planning
Goal estimated $500k per case with multiple cases to get this to the SC
I estimated at least 6 cases needed to keep each question narrow enough that the lower courts would have trouble answer a question not asked.

So a minimum of $3 million to get this going - unless one of the cases in the 4th or 7th is granted cert in the next session.

 

[DarthRevan]

I wish I could say I was surprised, but I'm not.

That Sam Adams quote has been coming to my mind an awful lot lately: "If you love wealth better than liberty, the tranquility of servitude better than the animating contest of freedom, go home from us in peace. We ask not your counsels nor your arms. Crouch down and lick the hands which feed you. May your chains set lightly upon you, and may posterity forget that you were our countrymen."

I love the animating contest of freedom: this law has me completely fired up. I feel like Jules cleaning up Marvin's brains from the back of the car in Jimmy's garage:
View attachment 901278

It's become obvious to me that there are MANY posters here who prefer the tranquility of servitude. Sam Adams had it right: thanks, but we don't need you. Go away. Hope it works out well for you, but when the future comes and I'm enjoying my rights with my children, I'll remember how all you cared about was f***ing grandfathering.

But you won't feel like my countryman. Not unless you get fired up now. It's not too late. I'm normally a very even-tempered guy, but if this kind of affront to your liberties doesn't make you incandescent with rage? Then what do you care about?

I used to get that mad but I saw the writing on the wall and left. Hopefully we can keep those losers out of office up here.
Hopefully my family with have the same values and respect for the constitution as they grow up as I do.
Time will tell.

Until then, FPC will keep getting money from me.

 

[DarthRevan]

Another one to remember:

Chief Michael J. Bradley, Jr., Executive Director, Massachusetts Chiefs of Police Association:

“The MCOPA leadership has voted to support H4885, also known as "An Act modernizing firearm laws.” We extend our appreciation to Speaker Mariano, Senate President Spilka, and Governor Healey for their continued efforts to work with our Association toward a compromise on gun reform and their shared focus on enhancing safety in the Commonwealth. We are committed to working closely with the Administration to address any challenges that may arise to ensure that the law's provisions are effectively put into practice.”

Some day you will all realize cops are not your friends. Especially not those at the top of the pile.

 

[HorizontalHunter]

Some day you will all realize cops are not your friends. Especially not those at the top of the pile.

Learned that lesson a long time ago.

 

[Ben Cartwright SASS]

They are different now. And this law won't happen, in the long run. It'll last two years? Three years? Five years? And then it'll go away forever. Because Bruen.

It's been posted a billion times here: this won't happen overnight. Bruen secured rights for our country, not necessarily for us who are sitting here now. So many NESers seem to have no concept of posterity. Sometimes, we do things not for ourselves, but for those who come after us.

If that mindset had afflicted Adams and Hancock, we wouldn't be free today. If it had afflicted King and Abernathy, black people would still be disenfranchised. There are countless other examples, as well. You're pissy because you can't snap your fingers and make magic happen right now... well, we're in this boat because our predecessors thought like you: they didn't fight for us, who are living now, because we weren't around yet.

We curse those predecessors for letting things get this bad, and rightly so. Unlike some, I don't want my children to curse me the same way.



I've posted about this. Most antis have no clue about the way the state already regulates guns; they've been told you can buy Glocks on the internet, and that's what they believe. So the media won't bother.



I talked to someone just today. He had no idea this would create a "roster" for his beloved bolt-actions. Well, he does now.

You are correct about the long game. THAT is something the left has done forever. Teddy Kennedy did the immigration reform act in '65 and said it wouldn't change the makeup of the country while knowing that eventually it would and we are paying for it now. The same with most things they do, while the right looks at today the left looks decades down the road.

 

[Nico9283]

You are more likely to get a ticket in a shit box since it's assumed to be less capable of safe handling at excess speeds than a higher quality car designed to operate at the higher speeds normal on German highways

This is your own biased opinion. There is no evidence that this is an opinion held by law enforcement.

 

[Reptile]

Which is also part of the planning
Goal estimated $500k per case with multiple cases to get this to the SC
I estimated at least 6 cases needed to keep each question narrow enough that the lower courts would have trouble answer a question not asked.

So a minimum of $3 million to get this going - unless one of the cases in the 4th or 7th is granted cert in the next session.

Is there a way to bait the state with a squeaky clean test case person?

Find a person to flaunt their AR until they get charged and then get a 2A organization to take up the case?

 

[alan226]

You are correct about the long game. THAT is something the left has done forever. Teddy Kennedy did the immigration reform act in '65 and said it wouldn't change the makeup of the country while knowing that eventually it would and we are paying for it now. The same with most things they do, while the right looks at today the left looks decades down the road.

And Reagan, the poster boy for the right, effed everything up agreeing to amnesty in 86, which is a huge reason why we are where we are at.

He admitted that was the biggest mistake of his presidency....

 

[Hombiez]

A copy or duplicate in the transaction database prior to 7/20/16 is not an ASW by definition - so it can be in its standard, extra-killy configuration.

Just a quick important point. That section doesn't say that its exempt from the features test and it doesn't say that its not an assault weapon. It only says that it's exempt from the copies or duplicates test. This is a good thing because the way this is written should actually make everything pre 8/1 eligible for all features.

Section 16 only says:
"provided further, that the firearm shall not be considered a copy or duplicate of a firearm identified in clauses (d) and (e) if sold, owned and registered prior to July 20, 2016"

It doesn't say that it's not an assault weapon - it says it's not a copy or duplicate. It doesn't exempt these from the features test or any other tests in the ASW definition.

Section 131M sub B is what exempts everything from all three tests.

"Section 131M. (a) No person shall possess, own, offer for sale, sell or otherwise transfer in the commonwealth or import into the commonwealth an assault-style firearm, or a large capacity feeding device.

(b) Subsection (a) shall not apply to an assault-style firearm lawfully possessed within the commonwealth on August 1, 2024, by an owner in possession of a license to carry issued under section 131 or by a holder of a license to sell under section 122; provided, that the assault-style firearm shall be registered in accordance with section 121B and serialized in accordance with section 121C.

So you have an assault weapon as defined by law, but the provision making assault weapons illegal doesn't apply to you if you owned it lawfully on 8/1. So you can have an assault weapon by any of those definitions as long as it was legal on 8/1. To me, this means you can have any feature you want on your rifle as long as it was in a legal configuration on 8/1 and you don't add the current evil features before 90 days from 7/25/2024

 

[Stuckbehindlines]

Some day you will all realize cops are not your friends. Especially not those at the top of the pile.

Nope, the boot lickers on here will continue to clap for them like a seal getting a fish at the Aquarium. After the corruption in the KR trial, the Brewster cop and the Melrose debacle to name just a few, everyone should be supporting an end to Qualified immunity.
Every time you support the boys in the blue gang you are helping to strip our rights. Pretty simple.

 

[Jenska22]

Just a quick important point. That section doesn't say that its exempt from the features test and it doesn't say that its not an assault weapon. It only says that it's exempt from the copies or duplicates test. This is a good thing because the way this is written should actually make everything pre 8/1 eligible for all features.

Section 16 only says:
"provided further, that the firearm shall not be considered a copy or duplicate of a firearm identified in clauses (d) and (e) if sold, owned and registered prior to July 20, 2016"

It doesn't say that it's not an assault weapon - it says it's not a copy or duplicate. It doesn't exempt these from the features test or any other tests in the ASW definition.

Section 131M sub B is what exempts everything from all three tests.

"Section 131M. (a) No person shall possess, own, offer for sale, sell or otherwise transfer in the commonwealth or import into the commonwealth an assault-style firearm, or a large capacity feeding device.

(b) Subsection (a) shall not apply to an assault-style firearm lawfully possessed within the commonwealth on August 1, 2024, by an owner in possession of a license to carry issued under section 131 or by a holder of a license to sell under section 122; provided, that the assault-style firearm shall be registered in accordance with section 121B and serialized in accordance with section 121C.

So you have an assault weapon as defined by law, but the provision making assault weapons illegal doesn't apply to you if you owned it lawfully on 8/1. So you can have an assault weapon by any of those definitions as long as it was legal on 8/1. To me, this means you can have any feature you want on your rifle as long as it was in a legal configuration on 8/1 and you don't add the current evil features before 90 days from 7/25/2024

lawyers gonna get rich

 

[maltc]

Breaking news.

 

[Jenska22]

You are more likely to get a ticket in a shit box since it's assumed to be less capable of safe handling at excess speeds than a higher quality car designed to operate at the higher speeds normal on German highways

I think its more likely that the s* box will get stopped is that is more likely to be a 3rd world driver with outstanding warrants anyway. The BMW will get stopped if they're having a bad day and want to burst someone's balls

 

[drgrant]

They're rushing because if they don't rush, they're afraid they'll be tagged as putting something into EFA10 after 01 AUG. In other words, the rush to get the guns purchased this week is a rush to comply. If sales don't fall off a cliff starting on 02AUG, well, then those are people who aren't rushing to comply.

Everyone wants that sweet, sweet grandfathering. That indicates that they're obeying this law. The noncompliant ones? They're not buying right now. They're already figuring out ways to circumvent the law.

...hypothetically.

Most of those not interested in compliance bought stuff years ago, they already got their pile of lowers, crates of new magazines, or what have you. This is not their first rodeo.

 

[not new guy]

They're rushing because if they don't rush, they're afraid they'll be tagged as putting something into EFA10 after 01 AUG. In other words, the rush to get the guns purchased this week is a rush to comply. If sales don't fall off a cliff starting on 02AUG, well, then those are people who aren't rushing to comply.

Is it a rush to comply or a rush to get guns that will most likely be unobtainable after next week? I bought one gun this week and it was one that I had wanted and that I don't expect to ever see available in MA again. No time soon anyway.

 

[Hardwired]

Was chatting with a coupe LEO's in the gun shop the other day. They were panic buying and also buying 10 round mags so they can carry when they're off duty. They were not happy about this BS and claimed their union is not happy and was also going to fight this new BS law. According to them, they were told when they clock out they need to also switch to a 10 round mag to comply with the new law.

And empty the boolits in the 17 rounders and lock the shit up.

 

[Taipan01]

The cops are not law experts on any laws. Theu know the basics any monkey can learn in 20 minutes.

I know that one..... disturbing the peace, the great catch all. I prefer Mopery but I'm a bit more refined.

 

[GL2020]

Well, let's not go TOO crazy.

No LEO is ever going to arrest a fellow LEO over carrying a standard-cap mag off-duty in violation of this law. The best we can hope for is that their supervisors will go full Linsky and demand their compliance.

I love that they're feeling the pinch right now. Maybe they'll remember that once they get their carve-out, which I agree they'll get as an amendment to this law... but I hope it doesn't happen until the NEXT legislative session, so that they can wriggle like the rest of us in the meantime.

Exactly when the method of enforcement depends on itself, it's never enforced

 

[drgrant]

True, but they'd know you had something. Probably several somethings. So when you register nothing, that's going to ring alarm bells. And a letter such as the one @Gasgunner suggests above, with no carrot at all but with the stick of revoking your LTC?

That would bully most of us into compliance, I suspect. Like I said, they have us by the balls. I assumed the EFA-10 system was a defacto registry from the start, and the current situation shows us how that's true.

They're going to have to be sending out thousands of those letters though.

Also the thing you posit, technically that's also something EOPS doesn't do. They might rat but they don't act. Suspensions or Revocations are on your issuing authority. Is your town going to pay a clerk locally to contact and threaten all these people? Lol

Regardless my response will be the same "Sorry, but, get f***ed"

 

[Palladin]

Gun Owners’ Action League Announces Referendum Effort to Repeal Omnibus Gun Law July 26, 2024 Westborough, MA – Gun Owners’ Action League (GOAL) in conjunction with the Massachusetts Conservation Alliance (MCA) and firearms retailers will be filing a referendum in accordance with Article 48 of the Massachusetts Constitution to repeal An Act Modernizing Firearm Laws. The law, formerly known as H.4885 (in its final iteration) was signed by Governor Healey yesterday, July 25th, 2024 and has yet to receive a session law number. Per the Secretary of the Commonwealth’s State Ballot Question Petitions guide: The Massachusetts Constitution provides that people have the right to affect the state laws by which they are governed. One way or persons to affect the laws is through the use of a petition for a ballot question. A referendum petition is used to have a law that was recently enacted by the legislature to be repealed by the voters. If filed properly and enough signatures are collected, the question will appear on the first state election 60 or more days after filing certified petitions with the Secretary. This means that the soonest a question can appear on the ballot is this November election. As there is no emergency preamble attached to this law, this process can cause the law to be suspended until the results of the vote are tallied. This means that if enough citizens sign the petition, the law will likely not go into effect until after the November election – if the question makes it to that ballot. In order for the law to be suspended, the number of signatures required is currently 49,716, which is 2% of the total votes cast for Governor in 2022. (MA Constitution Art. 81 § 4) GOAL has already begun taking the necessary steps to file a referendum on the new law and is working with MCA and firearms retailers in the Commonwealth to coordinate the collection of signatures once the petition is accepted by the Secretary. For more information about the new law and for future updates on the referendum’s progress, check out our website at goal.org.​

 

[Gunowner80]

Just a quick important point. That section doesn't say that its exempt from the features test and it doesn't say that its not an assault weapon. It only says that it's exempt from the copies or duplicates test. This is a good thing because the way this is written should actually make everything pre 8/1 eligible for all features.

Section 16 only says:
"provided further, that the firearm shall not be considered a copy or duplicate of a firearm identified in clauses (d) and (e) if sold, owned and registered prior to July 20, 2016"

It doesn't say that it's not an assault weapon - it says it's not a copy or duplicate. It doesn't exempt these from the features test or any other tests in the ASW definition.

Section 131M sub B is what exempts everything from all three tests.

"Section 131M. (a) No person shall possess, own, offer for sale, sell or otherwise transfer in the commonwealth or import into the commonwealth an assault-style firearm, or a large capacity feeding device.

(b) Subsection (a) shall not apply to an assault-style firearm lawfully possessed within the commonwealth on August 1, 2024, by an owner in possession of a license to carry issued under section 131 or by a holder of a license to sell under section 122; provided, that the assault-style firearm shall be registered in accordance with section 121B and serialized in accordance with section 121C.

So you have an assault weapon as defined by law, but the provision making assault weapons illegal doesn't apply to you if you owned it lawfully on 8/1. So you can have an assault weapon by any of those definitions as long as it was legal on 8/1. To me, this means you can have any feature you want on your rifle as long as it was in a legal configuration on 8/1 and you don't add the current evil features before 90 days from 7/25/2024

Section 121B says “shall be registered” - is this a section in the new bill speaking of future “registration “? If so, stripped lowers within your possession before 8/1/24 would not need any “registration”/FA 10, correct? Yes, I already know stripped lowers don’t need any FA10 entries, but should we build it out before 8/1/24 and then put it in the FA 10 that we currently have? I even heard that if you build your own, you don’t need to put it in the FA10 system.

 

[MGnoob]

Surprised they aren’t worried about all the bayonets that are going to make their way into mass now

I don't think they understand that by exempting those guns without language stating they had to be in a compliant state made it so that every one of them could legally be returned to its intended killy mode.

This is what I’m having a hard time accepting as it doesn’t make any goddamn sense

So somehow, Massachusetts just introduced other 30 years of “killly weapons“. Who wrote this shit really had their head up their ass