The Conference Committee has sent official language out - h.4885

[pastera]

Maybe, but is step#2 to request an injunction until the referendum?

No, we don't want an injunction
That will slow any lower court decision where we will ultimately lose anyway.
We want to lose fast in the lower courts so we can get to scotus faster.
The referendum delays enactment so we get the positive of an injunction without the massive delay in final judgment

 

[pastera]

Yeah, I read the same.

I'm likely the one who posted it.
Previously the law ignored privately manufactured firearms

 

[Gunowner80]

I'm likely the one who posted it.
Previously the law ignored privately manufactured firearms

Well, we are still under that law until 8/1, and the new bill states ” shall be registered“. IANAL. so I do think if it’s unbuilt there’s nothing to register, but when built, register in their new system.

 

[Mike508]

Having been in TX for 10+ years, I haven't spent time keeping up with PRM's firearms laws, so I am shocked to see this. Are they seriously requiring all firearms be registered? Soon you're gonna see news that all of them were confiscated. 'Cause that's how it works.

 

[drgrant]

Is it a rush to comply or a rush to get guns that will most likely be unobtainable after next week? I bought one gun this week and it was one that I had wanted and that I don't expect to ever see available in MA again. No time soon anyway.

I would say "more difficult to obtain" . nothing is unobtainable. And theres going to be varying grades of difficulty.

The only time something will ever be unobtainium is if a pant shitter is fussing over it. "ZOMG I cant buyh it cuz its iweeegullll!" etc. I think you get the drift.

 

[drgrant]

Having been in TX for 10+ years, I haven't spent time keeping up with PRM's firearms laws, so I am shocked to see this. Are they seriously requiring all firearms be registered? Soon you're gonna see news that all of them were confiscated. 'Cause that's how it works.

Meh. Most of the transfers are recorded already.

They're too lazy/cheap to confiscate guns wholesale. But you can bet your ass that in a year or two from now if that softball charge exists - eg, as compulsory registration... ("Possession of unregistered firearm") or some BS, and it only has a 1 pronged test, there are a lot of people who will get rapped by it if their gun is involved in some kind of an "incident"

 

[not new guy]

I would say "more difficult to obtain" . nothing is unobtainable. And theres going to be varying grades of difficulty.

The only time something will ever be unobtainium is if a pant shitter is fussing over it. "ZOMG I cant buyh it cuz its iweeegullll!" etc. I think you get the drift.

But then aren't you stuck either (a) registering it and confessing in the process; or (b) not registering it and carrying that risk? Is the expectation that the efa10 process will be dead (or ignored)?

 

[Uzi2]

Meh. Most of the transfers are recorded already.

They're too lazy/cheap SCARED to confiscate guns wholesale. But you can bet your ass that in a year or two from now if that softball charge exists - eg, as compulsory registration... ("Possession of unregistered firearm") or some BS, and it only has a 1 pronged test, there are a lot of people who will get rapped by it if their gun is involved in some kind of an "incident"

FIXED!

It will have nothing to do with "the gun" being involved in some kind of incident.....it will be the actions of some asshat cop trying to fvck you over for anything they can.

 

[drgrant]

But then aren't you stuck either (a) registering it and confessing in the process; or (b) not registering it and carrying that risk? Is the expectation that the efa10 process will be dead (or ignored)?

I'm not speaking on any of that garbage, just simply on practical terms.

That said I don't think someone registering something is defacto an "admission of anything" . It depends on what the "thing" is.

ETA: So lets play a hypothetical... fast forward 2 yrs, the database existss etc. There are two legal issues in play there. theres a "failure to register a firearm" and potential AWB compliance garbage.

The former is a chip shot for a convicttion the latter actually requires an investigation. Also when you register something EOPS doesnt know that a Faglaroid 9000 is an AR-15 clone, or anything about what the thing is.

 

[Mike508]

Meh. Most of the transfers are recorded already.

They're too lazy/cheap to confiscate guns wholesale. But you can bet your ass that in a year or two from now if that softball charge exists - eg, as compulsory registration... ("Possession of unregistered firearm") or some BS, and it only has a 1 pronged test, there are a lot of people who will get rapped by it if their gun is involved in some kind of an "incident"

Hey DR, been awhile ... a long while! I know I shouldn't be shocked with all this, but I am. I wish you all the best dealing with it.

 

[Marty McFly]

Isn't a referendum a dumb idea? The State aided by the media will push this as a ghost gun bill, and it will be upheld by a huge margin of voters. Won't that make it harder to beat?

Would it be a huge margin if all the yard signs said this hurts the police? This makes the police unsafe? It would be a decent spin angle.

 

[CatSnoutSoup]

No, we don't want an injunction

We do want one concurrent with the filing of a suit, but you are absolutely right we won't get it, so why file for one when it will just slow things down.

As for GOAL's petition for a referendum; I am hoping there is some deeper strategy here other than taking it all the way to a public vote.
Because we will lose on the question, and it would seem the State would then use that in support of their position in reply to any lawsuit.

Edit: I should add that unconstitutional is unconstitutional whether it was voted on or not (tyranny of the majority and all that), but still it is not helpful.

 

[drgrant]

That bit felt more to me like they were just lazy/incompetent and gave up trying to either connect or tie off those loose ends. They made it too complicated and losing the features ban was a casualty.

Yeah but thinking critically if you were an anti and you wanted to punish gun owners, having a law thats way more difficult to enforce works against
that, in a huge way.

But this whole section of law is such a pile of shit its hard to apply any logic to it.

 

[Uzi2]

I'm not speaking on any of that garbage, just simply on practical terms.

That said I don't think someone registering something is defacto an "admission of anything" . It depends on what the "thing" is.

ETA: So lets play a hypothetical... fast forward 2 yrs, the database existss etc. There are two legal issues in play there. theres a "failure to register a firearm" and potential AWB compliance garbage.

The former is a chip shot for a convicttion the latter actually requires an investigation. Also when you register something EOPS doesnt know that a Faglaroid 9000 is an AR-15 clone, or anything about what the thing is.

You've lost your mind.

When the state wants you behind bars, they will use anything they can find, even fabricate evidence against you to fulfil that goal.

 

[drgrant]

As for GOAL's petition for a referendum; I am hoping there is some deeper strategy here other than taking it all the way to a public vote.
Because we will lose on the question, and it would seem the State would then use that in support of their position in reply to any lawsuit.

Meh, I dont think that matters at all. The entire fulcrum of 2A lawfare, if you want to call it that, is literally protecting people against the
"tyranny of the majority" as an ongoing construct. "The public voted and doesnt like RKBA" doesnt nullify the right, on its own.

 

[CatSnoutSoup]

Meh, I dont think that matters at all. The entire fulcrum of 2A lawfare, if you want to call it that, is literally protecting people against the
"tyranny of the majority" as an ongoing construct. "The public voted and doesnt like RKBA" doesnt nullify the right, on its own.

I was writing my edit as you were writing your reply.

 

[drgrant]

You've lost your mind.

No I'm being realistic based on what I've seen previously in and around how the MA court system operates. It's not rocket science to assume that criminal charges with 1 pronged tests will be prosecuted more frequently than charges that are nuanced and require investigation.

 

[Hardwired]

“A referendum petition is a way for people to propose repealing a law enacted by the Legislature and are voted on in statewide general elections. Referendum petitions to repeal a law are filed with the Secretary of State’s Office 30 days after the law is enacted.”

Seems like it’s not a typical ballot question. People are voting to repeal or keep a current law. GOAL might have to exhaust every avenue of relief before they can file a lawsuit.

Even if it doesn’t pass because the leftist retards in beantown, I want to show the tally for our town/area and shove it down the Reps mouth that voted the party line instead of their constituents with calls, emails, and STOP HD4422 lawn signs.

 

[Uzi2]

No I'm being realistic based on what I've seen previously in and around how the MA court system operates. It's not rocket science to assume that criminal charges with 1 pronged tests will be prosecuted more frequently than charges that are nuanced and require investigation.

That doesn't help the poor slob who gets cuffed and stuffed and booked and their house tossed like a fvcking bomb hit it during ANY investigation, whether proper probable cause was obtained or not.

I've been the victim of it, I know EXACTLY WHAT CAN AND MOST LIKELY WILL HAPPEN............they'll fvck you over to a fare thee well if given half a chance.

 

[71montess]

Really wish I had bought all the parts I need to build the couple AR's I got stripped lowers for a while back. Never got around to getting any of the parts. Certainly don't have time to get parts, build (which I've never done before, this was going to be my first), serial and fa10 before the 1st

Plenty of videos on how to, parts are out there, mostly internet though. Maybe our own Marketplace can be a source ? Or a family or friend out of state.

 

[71montess]

That’s all well and good until you divorce, piss off a neighbor, or have a break in, or a medical emergency and “the man” enters your life uninvited.

Lock your gun room door. The man comes in the guns are out of sight.

 

[bigred460]

Breaking news.

Gun Owners’ Action League Announces Referendum Effort to Repeal Omnibus Gun Law July 26, 2024 Westborough, MA – Gun Owners’ Action League (GOAL) in conjunction with the Massachusetts Conservation Alliance (MCA) and firearms retailers will be filing a referendum in accordance with Article 48 of the Massachusetts Constitution to repeal An Act Modernizing Firearm Laws. The law, formerly known as H.4885 (in its final iteration) was signed by Governor Healey yesterday, July 25th, 2024 and has yet to receive a session law number. Per the Secretary of the Commonwealth’s State Ballot Question Petitions guide: The Massachusetts Constitution provides that people have the right to affect the state laws by which they are governed. One way or persons to affect the laws is through the use of a petition for a ballot question. A referendum petition is used to have a law that was recently enacted by the legislature to be repealed by the voters. If filed properly and enough signatures are collected, the question will appear on the first state election 60 or more days after filing certified petitions with the Secretary. This means that the soonest a question can appear on the ballot is this November election. As there is no emergency preamble attached to this law, this process can cause the law to be suspended until the results of the vote are tallied. This means that if enough citizens sign the petition, the law will likely not go into effect until after the November election – if the question makes it to that ballot. In order for the law to be suspended, the number of signatures required is currently 49,716, which is 2% of the total votes cast for Governor in 2022. (MA Constitution Art. 81 § 4) GOAL has already begun taking the necessary steps to file a referendum on the new law and is working with MCA and firearms retailers in the Commonwealth to coordinate the collection of signatures once the petition is accepted by the Secretary. For more information about the new law and for future updates on the referendum’s progress, check out our website at goal.org.​

Ballot questions are very expensive.

 

[sieveboy]

Isn't a referendum a dumb idea? The State aided by the media will push this as a ghost gun bill, and it will be upheld by a huge margin of voters. Won't that make it harder to beat?

Unless there is some other angle, there’s no way the voters in MA would rescind this new law. Speaking hypothetically, they could add drawing and quartering as a punishment to the bill and it would still likely pass a state-wide referendum cuz ghost gunz.

 

[HorizontalHunter]

It's not about beating it, it's about delaying it.

The big problem with a referendum is that GOAL will have to spend millions educating people about why this bill is so horrible and a lot of people, especially non gun owners, just won’t care as it doesn’t effect their civil rights.

It’s the same problem with protesting the ceremonial signing of the bill. A couple of hundred protesters is just a joke and looks worse than no one protesting.

Don’t get me wrong. It is great that GOAL is doing something about this horrible monstrosity.

 

[71montess]

They're rushing because if they don't rush, they're afraid they'll be tagged as putting something into EFA10 after 01 AUG. In other words, the rush to get the guns purchased this week is a rush to comply. If sales don't fall off a cliff starting on 02AUG, well, then those are people who aren't rushing to comply.

Everyone wants that sweet, sweet grandfathering. That indicates that they're obeying this law. The noncompliant ones? They're not buying right now. They're already figuring out ways to circumvent the law.

...hypothetically.

If I sold my guns out of state, as there is no requirement to prove this, I’m not remembering the guys last name.

 

[HorizontalHunter]

Lock your gun room door. The man comes in the guns are out of sight.

Agreed, but not going to stop a court order which in some cases is ridiculously easy to get.

 

[DarthRevan]

I was assured this couldn’t happen, post Bruen. Things are different now!

You know better, f***ers will still write bad laws, it's just backed up with SCOTUS precedent that it will be struck down.
Unfortunately it will take a while.

 

[Broc Tuah]

Faglaroid 9000

 

[MFSP101]

Am I understanding this correctly. As of 8/1/24. Because there is no long gun/shotgun roster. And all semi-autos are n jeopardy Does this mean none can be sold until there is one?

 

[drgrant]

That doesn't help the poor slob who gets cuffed and stuffed and booked and their house tossed like a fvcking bomb hit it during ANY investigation, whether proper probable cause was obtained or not.

I've been the victim of it, I know EXACTLY WHAT CAN AND MOST LIKELY WILL HAPPEN............they'll fvck you over to a fare thee well if given half a chance.

I get that part of it and I have had friends that went through the wringer (and one on on multiple occasions) but in most cases gun charges are a lot more boring than that while still being considerably legally perilous. The point I was trying to make is criminal charges that have convoluted series of requirements are not optimal for shitty governments trying tto
screw people. Like even when tthey screwed MTBS guy, they didnt come up with fancy shit for that. they had about 14 charges they applied on that guy, but they were all very basic
things. like 12 got dropped, which shows you how bogus the whole case was. They ended up getting him on a "silencer" or some bs and unlawful discharge within X feet of a
dwelling.

So yes, they could still screw you some other way. But in the reference to this bill, THAT situation is unchanged.