This.
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Why GOAL supports H.4376? Have they lost it?
- Thread starter CAESAR
- Start date
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This.
this is no different than being confused by situation where "my mother told me ABC, but this homeless fool is claiming XYZ"....why even listen to the fool? the NRA-ILA is useless in MA. they love to send out heated emails to stir up our pocketbooks....WRT MA, the NRA-ILA is all words and no action. at least GOAL took some action here and did something!
at this point the NRA-ILA could argue for pro-2A on the moon and I wouldn't be surprised.
I don't think that some of use realize just how well we did here. No more rejections by inaction or blanket CoP denials, now they have to try and justify their rejections in public court. That is huge anywhere but here even more so.
I couldn't agree more. The NRA has a long history of selling gun owners up the river. They have consistently refused to back bills and lawsuits that would undo some of the damage that has been done to the 2A over the past 90 or so years, but they crow about "victories" in an attempt to suck more money from their members. GOAL is following their lead in licking their masters glove and calling more restrictions a win.
bren42970
NES Member
The only person who's going to agree with your own opinion 100% will only be yourself. Tho a lot of us are disappointed with goals stand, with out them our voices would surely be ignored. The Fid bs sucks, we took a step back. I'm sure with out this site and goal we would of been hung out to dry IMHO. The FB comments bothered me on goals post, every one is entitled to there own opinion but gun owners need to be more united in there goals (no pun intended) and no offense to any one who moved to nh or any other state to avoid this, your only running away from a fight that will one day be in your new back yard should you stand watching the fight here in mass.
Really? We'll let me say this, GOALs statement that this bill is a 'net gain' is bullshit. It's not. It's a loss but it's MUCH smaller than it might have been so that's a positive but **** that, we lost "shall issue" on FID. that's a loss. They didn't **** us as badly as they wanted to, they did a very good job of neutering some of the worst provisions and honestly in this environment that's the best we can hope for but this isn't a 'win' for gun owners.
ntomsw
Banned
Yes, really.
Every GOAL thread turns into an abortion thread. Not sure why, but they do. So I was warning the OP to be careful.
Palladin
NES Member
It says "unsuitability shall be subject to judicial review", but I don't think it actually explicitly says anywhere what that entails, or does it?
As to GOAL, they probably have done well, but from the beginning have been a little eager to approve. When the law said <1 year misdemeanor was a disqualification, they initially said it was "consistent with federal law", while most on NES knew it wasn't. And since, they have had a number of fumbles in their statements, so when I hear them say this does xyz, I'm not as confident that they are correct. There are also some pretty big loses in there such as FID suitability. I know people say well, we got all these other things, but that only assumes that things play out the way they sound in your head. Saying it could have been worse is a logical fallacy everything could always be worse.
I do feel like they fumbled a bit trying to show a win though and for that reason I'm a little more skeptical than I might be otherwise. Whether or not they could have done better is another issue. The only real win for me would be if there was language that explicitly prevented worse things from happening next time we aren't looking; otherwise it's all just a shell game as far as I know.
They added back that Doctors can legally have talks regarding "lethal means" in the home (SECTION 14 Chapter 112, 5N). They also added back the Affidavit on renewals where you have to "verify" that you haven't had firearms stolen or lost since your last renewal (SECTION 36.9, 56.1). That verification could be anything from a YES/NO answer to LIST EVERYTHING YOU OWN HERE.
Sounds like a lawyer came up with that part since they would benefit off of it.
Remember when GOAL stood next to the governor in a press conference and called the AWB a victory for gun owners ?
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ntomsw
Banned
So, for all the people who are slightly confused about it....
"GOAL is the Official State Association of the National Rifle Association"
From Goal's website, http://www.goal.org/ . So the NRA home office is saying this bill sucks, and the local office is saying this bill rocks.
Confused? So, Goal, NRA, which position is "right", get your stories straight.
In my opinion, any bill that negatively impacts firearm owners in Massachusetts is a bad bill and should not be supported. The small compromises is what landed this commonwealth to be nationally recognized as draconian in regards to firearm laws.
****ing birthplace of america and whatnot, horse shit.
"GOAL is the Official State Association of the National Rifle Association"
From Goal's website, http://www.goal.org/ . So the NRA home office is saying this bill sucks, and the local office is saying this bill rocks.
Confused? So, Goal, NRA, which position is "right", get your stories straight.
In my opinion, any bill that negatively impacts firearm owners in Massachusetts is a bad bill and should not be supported. The small compromises is what landed this commonwealth to be nationally recognized as draconian in regards to firearm laws.
****ing birthplace of america and whatnot, horse shit.
Glockster30
NES Member
"people who shoot trap think you don't need AR-15's." That is true - I don't know anyone that shoots trap with an AR15.
![[laugh]](/xen/styles/default/xenforo/smilies.vb/012.gif "Laugh [laugh]")
GOA and JPFO are pro-Constitutional Carry. NRA will announce press releases "celebrating" whenever CC goes into effect in say, Arkansas, but whenever NH brings it up, and holds a veto-proof majority, the NRA effs it up.
Yeah, the NRA can be really sucky sometimes. GOAL can be sucky too, but just less frequent. They're being sucky here.
Just wait until future MA Governor Marsha Coakley, I mean, Steve Grossman gets his paws on what's left of MA gun laws. You ain't seen nothing yet.
Wallace, of the Gun Owners Action League, said his group also opposes both federal and state bans on principle, but realizes that the compromise approved yesterday is the best he can hope for in a state where gun-control measures are especially strong.
Please dude I'm a life Member and I am critical of GOAL when IMO it's warranted. Get your shit straight before you talk shit.
we are already may issue. the FID card is a joke. a 5rd pump shotgun or neutered bolt rifle, gimme a break....making FID cards may-issue is a small infringement in a state with many large 2A infringements.
the LTC-A is the license that matters....so long as the LTC-A is may-issue then MA is a may-issue state.
also, if S2284 ends up tanking and not getting passed, I want to hear every internet Rambo explain to me the next piece of legislation that includes 1 gun per month, 7rd mags and more AWB bullshit........be careful what you wish for cuz it might just happen.
ntomsw
Banned
And, we're off.
Perfect example is this thread right here. I say 1 thing about GOAL, and look...FAIL. They support this, and that's all the people of MA need to know. They FAIL and are a FAILURE.
I also didn't "talk shit." I made a statement and stand by it. I don't need anyone's approval to make a statement about an org.
Agreed. Some people need to spend some time comparing DeLeo's original bill to this one and then realize just what state they're in. Disagreeing with anything anti or anything other than "shall issue" is great in theory but as pointed out a couple of times within this thread, we are a minority. Take into account how many gun owners are fudds and might not care about LTC's and we're even a bigger minority. Those who called their reps and otherwise participated during all of this are very likely the reason we ended up on the bad end of "just the tip" as opposed to some serious ankle grabbing. If you want to do nothing because you don't like that an FID application can be taken to court for refusal, that's your choice. Realize, however, that your inaction might be the reason we deep dicked with no lube next time around and feel free to spare those who tried your whining. YOU'RE IN THE LIBERAL HEART OF THE EASTERN PART OF THE COUNTRY. Refusing to participate to save the rights you have left on some misguided "principle" is foolish at best.
I don't care if you don't like this. It is the reality of things as they currently stand.
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• Collectors can now purchase handguns and firearms that may not comply with the approved firearms roster?!?!
This is legal now..... wtf
This is legal now..... wtf
As a private citizen, I have the luxury to oppose this bill without ramification. But I also accept that I live in a state where my beliefs with regard to the 2nd Amendment are in the minority, and that those lobbying on behalf of my beliefs (i.e. GOAL) are fighting an uphill battle. And I accept that they must make some concessions I may not agree with in order to be able to function as the lobbyist of a minority. And I accept that they're inherently going to lose more than they win.
So when they go up against a potentially disastrous bill, successfully lobby to get the majority of the most damaging items removed and even walk away with a few victories, I'm not going to be so ignorant and shortsighted as to slap them in the face for their efforts.
Too many of you remind me of my toddler when she throws temper tantrum, screaming "Shall not be infringed!!!" at the top of your lungs while doing nothing constructive for yourself or Massachusetts gun owners. She's two. What's your excuse? Maybe it's time to grow up.
So when they go up against a potentially disastrous bill, successfully lobby to get the majority of the most damaging items removed and even walk away with a few victories, I'm not going to be so ignorant and shortsighted as to slap them in the face for their efforts.
Too many of you remind me of my toddler when she throws temper tantrum, screaming "Shall not be infringed!!!" at the top of your lungs while doing nothing constructive for yourself or Massachusetts gun owners. She's two. What's your excuse? Maybe it's time to grow up.
ntomsw
Banned
Ok.
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