Are you not allowed to better your job? Who wouldn't want to better their job? Just because they are a public servant, they can't better their job or make it more safe?
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Please tell me this isn't a real question.
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Amend LEOSA for C.O's
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Are you not allowed to better your job? Who wouldn't want to better their job? Just because they are a public servant, they can't better their job or make it more safe?
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Please tell me this isn't a real question.
Because dealing with the actual problems is too hard.
Boghog1
NES Member
so if the financial industry gets a special privilege of say no longer having to pay income tax it would be okay with you then, they are just bettering their job after all, I am sure there is enough money in the banking industry we could get that pushed through easily enough
Also it's quite ignorant to refer to inmates as "scum of the earth" ... these are human beings to. Some of them are bad people, some are sick, some just made a mistake. They all broke a law of some sort, theres no argument there, but being completely honest who hasnt broken at least 1 law in their life. Sometimes luck and timing are everything.
Refering to these people as scum of the earth implies how you interact with these people, I dont doubt they hate you if you call them scum and treat them as such.
That said, by perpepuating a 2 class system for gun ownership there will never be equality. This is also the argument for the NY boycott. All you arguing in favor of the LEOSA should also be against the NY boycott then.
Refering to these people as scum of the earth implies how you interact with these people, I dont doubt they hate you if you call them scum and treat them as such.
That said, by perpepuating a 2 class system for gun ownership there will never be equality. This is also the argument for the NY boycott. All you arguing in favor of the LEOSA should also be against the NY boycott then.
Boghog1
NES Member
please explain how it isn't even close. both are a small few getting a special privilege. would it be more realistic if it was only those that worked for the IRS?
I'm sure the murderers, rapist and pedophiles, learn to hate COs too "especially those in charge", just saying
Boghog1
NES Member
yes like that "rapist" 18yo kid that got nailed for banging his 16yo girlfriend and is now treated like "scumof the earth" or that "dealer that had half a pond of pot and was getting the dope for his close friends.
Since this is devolving into a discussion on the prison state. I urge you all to read the article from the economist, it's a real eye opener. Rough justice in America: Too many laws, too many prisoners | The Economist
"...Some 3,700 people who committed neither violent nor serious crimes are serving life sentences under California's “three strikes and you're out” law. In Alabama a petty thief called Jerald Sanders was given a life term for pinching a bicycle..."
"...Some 3,700 people who committed neither violent nor serious crimes are serving life sentences under California's “three strikes and you're out” law. In Alabama a petty thief called Jerald Sanders was given a life term for pinching a bicycle..."
Ok, I can concede that some people are in prison for the reasons you state. Can you concede there are truly dangerous people in prison- like the examples I gave? My point in conjunction with someone who already made it, is COs, unlike most cops are around the former AND the latter at least 8 hours a day. I support COs expansion of gun carry/freedom. I'm for the expansion of ANYones freedom concerning gun laws. Yes in a perfect world we should all have that right, but I'm not going to cry because heTommy got an ice cream and Suzie didn't.
First of its exactly the same thing. Secondly more "citizens" carrying is a fallacy because its clear that tptb are labeling LEO aa sehow different from everone else. Why let some but not others. So much for and liberty and justice for all.
Those are not the type of people they are talking about. Most in jail are not like that especially in this state where we don't like to send most to jail. You cannot have a rationale discussion here can you?
Still not even close, therefore its not worth an argument. I already gave you my point back in post 57 and the way I look at it. If you don't agree than fine.
I think everyone should be allowed to carry anywhere they want. It's a fundamental right. Like I said before, this year its CO's next year its veterans, and so on. Baby steps. You are going to change a hundred year of laws overnight.
No, I am not a CO.
Next year they wanted to add veterans to it, would you be against it? Are they not citizens too? Then the following security guards.
If not, then whats your plan. Because so far NOTHING else it working. I'll be on board if you can come up with a plan that will work. Haven't seen one yet, though
It depends which way you want to look at it. 50% of the people in the country pay no fed income tax. Some say these people in the lower half of the income spectrum not paying anything is unfair some say it is a good start., let's stop taxing the top 50% too.
For you LEOs and COs, understand the history here. Just about every anti-gun law that comes out aimed at the commoners contains LEO exceptions. And when they happen to forget an exception (New York) the people in charge are quick to point out that LEOs shouldn't worry about it, and the law will be "fixed" soon to take care of them. We hear solemn quotes and learned opinions from chiefs and the like, all saying they think the new law is a good idea. On the internet people tell us the rank and file think new gun control is a bad idea, but they can't talk in public about that. What we never hear is someone in a uniform saying it is hypocritical and bad for liberty to single out one class and put them against another when it comes to individual rights. Never said.
As the years pass and government becomes ever more intrusive, the role of the police state is undeniable. Many of you in law enforcement no doubt see hostility out there. Law abiding taxpaying honest people with no record are seeing police as the hammer of government. When doors get kicked in, dogs shot, justice denied, and rights assaulted, the man in the photo is not the lawmaker who passed the bill or the voter who elected him. The man in the photo is you. And you are, increasingly, pissing people off just by wearing that uniform.
Corrections officers are enabling a prison system that is a disgrace. What happens inside is a mystery to most of us. But when incarceration and sodomy are so linked as to be a standing joke many of us see any prison sentence as a death sentence. We know people are arrested and imprisoned for victimless crimes. We know, just mathematically, that an absurd portion of our population is in prison. You make that possible. Of course people are angry about that. Did you take the job assuming otherwise?
You can't take the job, keep your mouth shut, protect others on the job, look the other way, and just follow orders --- you can't do that and not become part of the problem. From the outside looking in, most of us suspect that is standard operating procedure. We don't trust police. We fear them. We don't trust the system. We know it is corrupt. We don't believe in justice. We know that concept is dead.
Naturally we understand many of you (probably most) are decent honest people just doing a job. The problem is we don't know who you are. And even among you there is the strong chance that when pressure is applied you will protect your own at our expense, even if that means justice is denied. We know the thin blue line is there. We know what side of it we are on. We know that any LEO who calls out abuse or corruption is going to be hammered for doing it it. We know what that means for us.
Do you understand now why we don't jump with joy at the idea of giving you more power and more privilege? If the idea were to give, say, dentists LEOSA coverage it would seem arbitrary and unfair. As it is, this idea is worse.
As the years pass and government becomes ever more intrusive, the role of the police state is undeniable. Many of you in law enforcement no doubt see hostility out there. Law abiding taxpaying honest people with no record are seeing police as the hammer of government. When doors get kicked in, dogs shot, justice denied, and rights assaulted, the man in the photo is not the lawmaker who passed the bill or the voter who elected him. The man in the photo is you. And you are, increasingly, pissing people off just by wearing that uniform.
Corrections officers are enabling a prison system that is a disgrace. What happens inside is a mystery to most of us. But when incarceration and sodomy are so linked as to be a standing joke many of us see any prison sentence as a death sentence. We know people are arrested and imprisoned for victimless crimes. We know, just mathematically, that an absurd portion of our population is in prison. You make that possible. Of course people are angry about that. Did you take the job assuming otherwise?
You can't take the job, keep your mouth shut, protect others on the job, look the other way, and just follow orders --- you can't do that and not become part of the problem. From the outside looking in, most of us suspect that is standard operating procedure. We don't trust police. We fear them. We don't trust the system. We know it is corrupt. We don't believe in justice. We know that concept is dead.
Naturally we understand many of you (probably most) are decent honest people just doing a job. The problem is we don't know who you are. And even among you there is the strong chance that when pressure is applied you will protect your own at our expense, even if that means justice is denied. We know the thin blue line is there. We know what side of it we are on. We know that any LEO who calls out abuse or corruption is going to be hammered for doing it it. We know what that means for us.
Do you understand now why we don't jump with joy at the idea of giving you more power and more privilege? If the idea were to give, say, dentists LEOSA coverage it would seem arbitrary and unfair. As it is, this idea is worse.
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I don't begrudge those covered under it. However giving govt employees privelages the rest of us do not have is not right. If none of the cops and cos where covered they would be more vocal in getting all of us the right.
Kisspik002
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I love my job...again I'm not saying I'm better than anyone else. So what cops can carry all over the country who cares, we're never gonna have a nationwide CCW law.
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+1. Well said
Kisspik002
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Bottom line boghog...cops do have a few perks that most don't, it comes with the badge. AGAIN I SAID I SUPPORT NATIONWIDE CCW FOR ALL CITIZENS. I said if carrying all over the country is that important to you become a cop or a politician
Boghog1
NES Member
Yes, Chief Cahill testified last week against constitutional carry, and I can guarantee that if I didn't have a permit and carried concealed and was caught t I would be looking at arrest in NH
Why should they be more priveleged than anyone else? Why in ban states can they have goodies everyone else can not?
Kisspik002
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Take it easy pal unless your a cop or co you have no idea ok. My comment of scum of the earth was a generalized statement. Sorry next time ill say child molesters, drug addicts, gang members. Bottom line is cops have been given the right to carry anywhere in the country, who cares. If you follow the news esp with recent gun control issues you know there will never be a nationwide law allowing CCW of private citizens. So basically all I'm saying is yes I support gun rights for all, I want nationwide carry, I want everyone to have and buy what they want. But you can't stand there and pout about how cops can and I can't. Cops can do a lot of things other people can not, just like car salesman or bankers can do things others can't. Each and every job has perks and privileges that's others do not.
dixidawg
NES Member
Bullshit.
Gun rights are not a perks or priveleges. They are RIGHTS and should not be doled out only to the protected classes.
Kisspik002
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I don't care what you do. While I can respect and agree with your position on this I don agree that comparing cops and guns to IRS and taxes or the above statement, I highly doubt there are any cops right now trying to infringe on your right to carry.
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Kisspik002
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Then become a politician or throw a badge on and walk the line either way, were not talking about gun rights were talking about off duty cops being allowed to carry anywhere in the us. I'm pro gun all the way, I'm not debating gun rights, I'm debating LEOSA
Boghog1
NES Member
Apparently you don't follow what CoP associations do, or crap like pushing against laws allowing us commoners from filming them. you can relax because you don't have to worry about where you are going to get jammed up for practicing a right . if I drive 20 minutes south and gett pulled over with my post ban >10 round magazine in a pistol, you are going to either put me through hell financially or put me in "put it in the arse prison" where I will become even more jaded and POd at people just doing their job. you may want all people to carry legally but you are in fact a small portion of law enforcement, there is a great deal of you that are highly vocal about how citizens should not carry.
This.
Kisspik002
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personally I wouldn't do anything, prob tell ya to keep a 10 rounder in your car if you frequent MA. I told you I agree with gun RIGHTS FOR ALL, I'm not even one bit anti gun. My argument is made that yes LEOs can carry and while I don't often carry under it I would be the first one next to you supporting more rights for everyone, look I'm not in any way someone that thinks I'm above everyone else, and likes said while I support your view and agree with it, don't shit on cops or co or veterans or anyone who is covered under LEOSA. I'm all done going back and forth with this. Have a great day everyone
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