AR-15 thread... I'll show you mine if you show me yours.

SwampYankee42 said:
I impulse bought a vortex micro 3x last night. This solves my issue. I figure I'll keep the holosun for some other project.
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If you're looking to mount the back up iron sight behind the mount of the magnifier, the big problem you might have is eye relief with the micro magnifiers. I found that the shorter magnifiers were way too short. in order to make them work, I think they really need to be mountoed as far back on the rail as possible.

What works well for mounting the rear sight behind the magnifier is a magnifier with a longer tube like the one you already have, but one with a smaller mount that will allow the rear iron sight to be mounted behind it. If you're going to push a magnifier forward to get a sight behind it, you really need one with all of the eye relief you can get, and using one with a longer tube to bring that glass closer to your eye really helps out a lot.

The problem with micro magnifiers in this configuration is that they're already shorter to begin with, and they typically already have less eye relief than the longer magnifiers. So moving them any farther forward to get the backup sight behind it, really throws the eye relief out the window. And you end up realizing that in order to accommodate a back up iron sight that you'll probably never use, you've gone and really limited your ability to shoot well and comfortably with your primary optic set up that you'll use often. That is a problem.
 
LakeTrout said:
If you're looking to mount the back up iron sight behind the mount of the magnifier, the big problem you might have is eye relief with the micro magnifiers. I found that the shorter magnifiers were way too short. in order to make them work, I think they really need to be mountoed as far back on the rail as possible.

What works well for mounting the rear sight behind the magnifier is a magnifier with a longer tube like the one you already have, but one with a smaller mount that will allow the rear iron sight to be mounted behind it. If you're going to push a magnifier forward to get a sight behind it, you really need one with all of the eye relief you can get, and using one with a longer tube to bring that glass closer to your eye really helps out a lot.

The problem with micro magnifiers in this configuration is that they're already shorter to begin with, and they typically already have less eye relief than the longer magnifiers. So moving them any farther forward to get the backup sight behind it, really throws the eye relief out the window. And you end up realizing that in order to accommodate a back up iron sight that you'll probably never use, you've gone and really limited your ability to shoot well and comfortably with your primary optic set up that you'll use often. That is a problem.
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The mounting hardware looks similar. Maybe if I find the eye relief to be an issue I'll swap the vortex' smaller mount over the holosun to retain the longer magnifier but give myself an ample footprint to mount the rear sight.

Even with the holosun on the second to last rail notch I found myself having to cozy up to the scope and get a good cheekweld before I could get a nice picture thru it.
At this point the micro is on it's way so I'll either be able to stick with it or swap the mounts keep the micro for some over purpose.
Good point though and thank you
 
SwampYankee42 said:
The mounting hardware looks similar. Maybe if I find the eye relief to be an issue I'll swap the vortex' smaller mount over the holosun to retain the longer magnifier but give myself an ample footprint to mount the rear sight.

Even with the holosun on the second to last rail notch I found myself having to cozy up to the scope and get a good cheekweld before I could get a nice picture thru it.
At this point the micro is on it's way so I'll either be able to stick with it or swap the mounts keep the micro for some over purpose.
Good point though and thank you
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Yes, magnifiers are really tough for eye relief. Even the ones that claim to have a decent amount of it. Took me a while to get everything set up and figured out but once you do you’ll be happy. Let us know how you make out.
 
bigblue said:
A ton of new shooters have learned their way around a rifle without ever shooting irons. BUIS are a fail safe and not practicing with a fail safe is like having a fire extinguisher without ever pulling the pin on one. TF happens when you need it? Is it even zeroed? At what distance? Hopefully minute of man, I guess.

Obv when I write it’s my opinion so I don’t feel the need to caveat what I write. But having a battle rifle without BUIS seems silly to me regardless of the optic you put on it. Cracked glass or any number of things can take out that optic and with no options, are you planning to point shoot?

I have plenty of dots, scopes, & LPVO’s. All of them have been setup to accommodate BUIS.

It’s not an accident, it’s a plan.
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I got a karma to a garand shoot a few years ago. Never shot an actual war M1 before then (I’ve shot a modern one with a dot but irrelevant). I was shooting irons at 200 yards, think I scored 230ish (?) on my first outing sitting, standing and prone.

I’m not at all worried about my skill with dots, optics or irons even on an unfamiliar gun at medium distances.

If I crack my glass or bend up my optic/dot do I have the tools to remove it if it’s obstructing my irons? Not all come with a quick release.

But my real question is where is your rear buis with a lpvo or a higher mag optic?

So when you practice with the buis, do you remove the optic/dot or co witness. My lpvo’s have a retical so I will see that (even without the illuminated dot)

My dots, yup that I can see maybe being able to practice with those while off.

Not my pic. But a sad example of buis with a lpvo for illustration. Hope he has the tools to remove it. Otherwise useless.

IMG_3117.png
 
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My optics (both dots & scopes) are mounted with LaRue QD so they get removed.

I do have range toys without irons that have optics mounted without QD. GHM9 kind of stuff. Well actually that comes with irons. I’m sure there are a few subguns without irons.
 
chris_1001 said:
I got a karma to a garand shoot a few years ago. Never shot an actual war M1 before then (I’ve shot a modern one with a dot but irrelevant). I was shooting irons at 200 yards, think I scored 230ish (?) on my first outing sitting, standing and prone.

I’m not at all worried about my skill with dots, optics or irons even on an unfamiliar gun at medium distances.

If I crack my glass or bend up my optic/dot do I have the tools to remove it if it’s obstructing my irons? Not all come with a quick release.

But my real question is where is your rear buis with a lpvo or a higher mag optic?

So when you practice with the buis, do you remove the optic/dot or co witness. My lpvo’s have a retical so I will see that (even without the illuminated dot)

My dots, yup that I can see maybe being able to practice with those while off.

Not my pic. But a sad example of buis with a lpvo for illustration.

View attachment 753283
Click to expand...
Generally, on a 1x dot the BUIS is inline on the receiver rail and can be cowitnessed. That also makes it easy to check to see if the BUIS is relatively holding zero. On a magnified optic or LPVO, the BUIS can be mounted offset if the shooter desires to get to them quick and they do not have a quick release mount for the LPVO or magnified optic.

Keep in mind, even with red dots, the inline BUIS is useful in a battery or electronic failure but may not be useful quickly in a shattered optic failure.
 
LakeTrout said:
Generally, on a 1x dot the BUIS is inline on the receiver rail and can be cowitnessed. That also makes it easy to check to see if the BUIS is relatively holding zero. On a magnified optic or LPVO, the BUIS can be mounted offset if the shooter desires to get to them quick and they do not have a quick release mount for the LPVO or magnified optic.
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Agree on all points. But I’m not arguing with you!!!! Lol.

To prove I’m not anti buis.

These are two of my AR’s. I did swap the bottom aimpoint for a lpvo and put the buis on another build.

IMG_3116.png
 
LakeTrout said:
You have some really nice setups!
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Thanks. Here is where the aimpoint ended up (AR-9 build) and another with one of my lpvo’s

Since this is a show me thread, gotta represent. Lol

I “might” have a few others but no pics.

And no, I don’t run thermomold or orlights. Staged pic for something else. So no teasing me on that. Lol.


IMG_3119.png IMG_3118.png
 
bigblue said:
Something wrong with those, doesn’t look like the trigger is functional.

But those AimPoint mounts are QD. Very poor QD but they do come off with a hard twist.
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lol. It the new mass compliant AR trigger. AG approved.

Yup. I’m using the stock aimpoint qd mount.

I just give it a check now and then. Has not failed me after several hard core classes.

On another build I do have a QD mount on the lpvo. Above it needs a wrench
 
bigblue said:
My Atlas has an ADM and it’s very stiff, I do prefer LaRue but Spuhr also makes some excellent ones.
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I had some trouble at first but once I got the nut tightened correctly it has been very user friendly, Spuhr I haven't heard of, I might give them a search for my next build
 
@SHOCKNAWE thanks for the vortex micro recommendation.
Fits perfectly and I can even deploy the BUIS with the magnifier swung to the side. The mount and qd also feels much nicer than the holosun.
 

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chris_1001 said:
I got a karma to a garand shoot a few years ago. Never shot an actual war M1 before then (I’ve shot a modern one with a dot but irrelevant). I was shooting irons at 200 yards, think I scored 230ish (?) on my first outing sitting, standing and prone.

I’m not at all worried about my skill with dots, optics or irons even on an unfamiliar gun at medium distances.

If I crack my glass or bend up my optic/dot do I have the tools to remove it if it’s obstructing my irons? Not all come with a quick release.

But my real question is where is your rear buis with a lpvo or a higher mag optic?

So when you practice with the buis, do you remove the optic/dot or co witness. My lpvo’s have a retical so I will see that (even without the illuminated dot)

My dots, yup that I can see maybe being able to practice with those while off.

Not my pic. But a sad example of buis with a lpvo for illustration. Hope he has the tools to remove it. Otherwise useless.

View attachment 753283
Click to expand...
Someone in the past mentioned this to me when I shared pictures of a build.
Those irons are useless unless it's a qd mount or you carry a tool to remove the mount
 
SwampYankee42 said:
@SHOCKNAWE thanks for the vortex micro recommendation.
Fits perfectly and I can even deploy the BUIS with the magnifier swung to the side. The mount and qd also feels much nicer than the holosun.
Click to expand...
This is not a snarky post, although I have a feeling it is going to come off as though it is. But I think if you're going to go to the lengths that you have to ensure that you have multiple levels of redundancy with regard to sighting options, I think you would be better served by actual iron sights. Okay, not sure if they're actually iron. But magpul does make a really nice set of flip up "irons" that are very tough and hold zero and I would trust much more for an end of the world rifle than the plastic one you have behind the magnifier.

It seems to me that if you've already taken it to this level, you kind of should go just about 80 bucks further (at least thats what they used to go for) and put a real rear sight on that rail.

Again, not being snarky. Just my recommendation. Seems as though that setup deserves the metal flip up sight.

Edit: Also, slight benefit: It is also a bit slimmer than the plastic one which is nicer to have when mounted so far to the rear where you are grabbing the charging handle. The metal one is a bit lower profile in that position.
 
LakeTrout said:
This is not a snarky post, although I have a feeling it is going to come off as though it is. But I think if you're going to go to the lengths that you have to ensure that you have multiple levels of redundancy with regard to sighting options, I think you would be better served by actual iron sights. Okay, not sure if they're actually iron. But magpul does make a really nice set of flip up "irons" that are very tough and hold zero and I would trust much more for an end of the world rifle than the plastic one you have behind the magnifier.

It seems to me that if you've already taken it to this level, you kind of should go just about 80 bucks further (at least thats what they used to go for) and put a real rear sight on that rail.

Again, not being snarky. Just my recommendation. Seems as though that setup deserves the metal flip up sight.

Edit: Also, slight benefit: It is also a bit slimmer than the plastic one which is nicer to have when mounted so far to the rear where you are grabbing the charging handle. The metal one is a bit lower profile in that position.
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I totally agree. These are magpul mbus I had lying around. I do have plans to purchase metal sights, kinda kicking around between ultradyne, sig or midwest industries.
I like what troy offers but I cant stomach giving them money on moral grounds
 
SwampYankee42 said:
I totally agree. These are magpul mbus I had lying around. I do have plans to purchase metal sights, kinda kicking around between ultradyne, sig or midwest industries.
I like what troy offers but I cant stomach giving them money on moral grounds
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I don’t blame you. I don’t have much experience with a lot of different ones but the magpul rear iron sight called the MBUS PRO is great. Really low profile too which is awesome in that rear position above the charging handle. Almost like it’s not even there.
 
Rockrivr1 said:
I know it’s a joke but I’ve been seeing more and more offset iron sight on posts in several forums. Not sure I’d want them like that but it seems to be popular.
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I’d probably only consider them (offset) if I had a magnified optic OVER 1x. As co witnessed irons through say a 3x+ min optic would defeat the purpose.

I suppose in my lpvo example where the rear won’t fit due to the location on the upper.

But just another thing to get hung up. Esp as I’ll use what I can as a “support”
 

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