EVERY SHOOTER Should Get a C&R FFL!

[Len-2A Training]

Well my renewed C&R FFL arrived in yesterday's Mail. So I sadly don't get the opportunity to put BATFE Licensing in the "hot seat" as to why it took 2.5 months!

LenS did you ever get your C&R renewed, or is the ATF still messing with you?

See Post 2113 - received on 7/28 . . . and spoiled my fun that I had planned for them!

 

[exo]

See Post 2113 - received on 7/28 . . . and spoiled my fun that I had planned for them!

Well, at least you finally got it. You'll just have to try and transmute that anger into something else. Perhaps a nice C&R gun?

 

[kalash]

I don't think it says anywhere on the application that a Certification of Compliance is required, does it?

Last question before my application goes in the mail: do I need to send a copy of the certification form to my CoP or doea that one go only to the ATF?

 

[Len-2A Training]

Last question before my application goes in the mail: do I need to send a copy of the certification form to my CoP or doea that one go only to the ATF?

ATF only.

ETA: I also redact the credit card info on the copy to the chief. TMI and I don't trust anyone with my cc info that does not have a "need to know"!

 

[inerlogic]

A C&R is anything 50 years old or older back to 1898 (or special item on their list) at which point it becomes an antique and is not classified as a [STRIKE=0]C&R[/STRIKE] firearm at all.

FIFY

 

[Pilgrim]

FIFY

we're both right

 

[RDG]

Last question before my application goes in the mail: do I need to send a copy of the certification form to my CoP or doea that one go only to the ATF?

FYI.. I'm not sure if the ATF requires the certification form anymore. I didn't send one in with my application and it was approved in 4 weeks. This was June/July timeframe this year.

 

[browncoat]

ATF only.

ETA: I also redact the credit card info on the copy to the chief. TMI and I don't trust anyone with my cc info that does not have a "need to know"!

On the credit card info note - the ATF supplied PDF that I filled out this summer had 2 forms in it - one with credit card info for submitting to them, and one with a missing payment section for submission to the CoP.

 

[ewaybevinn]

Got it! Sent out 7/1 got the second page back on 8/4 because I forgot to fill it out correctly. Got the licence yesterday

Harvard Sportsman's Club
NRA Member

 

[kalash]

Application is in the mail Thanks for all the help!

 

[OCB]

Any idea when they usually send out renewal forms (i.e. 1 month before expiration of license, 2 months, etc.)?

 

[Len-2A Training]

Any idea when they usually send out renewal forms (i.e. 1 month before expiration of license, 2 months, etc.)?

Mid May for Aug 1 renewal, so 2.5 months. Not enough time for some of us that they dick around before issuing the renewed C&R.

 

[kalash]

Am I correct in thinking that an SKS is still a no-go even with a C&R under Boston's AWB?

 

[LuvToGoFast]

You ask "Why should I have a C&R FFL?"

- C&R FFLs can obtain C&R eligible (ONLY) firearms anywhere in the US in a face-to-face transaction or have them shipped DIRECTLY to the C&R FFL! [This assumes no state law to the contrary. This works for MA.]

- C&R FFLs can thus purchase handguns that DEALER FFLs can NOT sell in MA! [Chapter 180 prohibited "Purveyors" of firearms from selling firearms that are untested, not on the List, etc. But since C&R FFLs are NOT Dealers ("purveyors") they are EXEMPT from this portion of the law.]

- C&R FFLs get Wholesale pricing from places like: Brownells, Midway USA, Grafs, etc. This can easily save you >$30.00 over the 3 years.

I'm sure this has been asked, but if I'm reading this correctly, with a C&R I can buy a...Lets say Star Model B...and have it shipped to me with my C&R License. BUT, an FFL in ma can't transfer it to me?

 

[Len-2A Training]

I'm sure this has been asked, but if I'm reading this correctly, with a C&R I can buy a...Lets say Star Model B...and have it shipped to me with my C&R License. BUT, an FFL in ma can't transfer it to me?

Correct on both counts. I own a Star Model B and obtained exactly that way.

 

[browncoat]

Am I correct in thinking that an SKS is still a no-go even with a C&R under Boston's AWB?

I think so. I live in Boston, and I can't bring my SKS here, or at least that is how it seems.

edit: Maybe this section gives us a way out?

The provisions of this act shall not apply to the possession of assault weapons, large capacity magazines, large capacity magazine belts, or other types of magazines or ammunition belts by persons specifically authorized to acquire, have, possess or carry an assault weapon pursuant to federal law.

edit 2: The Boston AWB is really poorly written to begin with, for example Section 2(k) contradicts 1(f). It is kind of hard to tell what "specifically authorized" means in relation to a C&R FFL. I rather don't want to be the person to find out.

 

[inerlogic]

Wow.... Boston sucks....

 

[J.A.C]

Just got my C&R in the mail today! I will be re-reading the info in this thread tonight

 

[kalash]

Application is in the mail Thanks for all the help!

One month on the dot and it just came in.

 

[kalash]

Since its the receiver that's truly considered to be the gun, it would seem perfectly acceptable to take a C&R Mosin and change the stock, the bolt, etc, as long as the receiver was original. Correct?

 

[RTFM]

Q: What modifications can be made on C&R firearms without changing their C&R classification?
The definition for curio or relic (“C & R”) firearms found in 18 U.S.C. 27 CFR § 478.11 does not specifically state that a firearm must be in its original condition to be classified as a C&R firearm. However, ATF Ruling 85-10, which discusses the importation of military C&R firearms, notes that they must be in original configuration and adds that a receiver is not a C&R item. Combining this ruling and the definition of C&R firearms, the Firearms Technology Branch (FTB) has concluded that a firearm must be in its original condition to be considered a C&R weapon.
It is also the opinion of FTB, however, that a minor change such as the addition of scope mounts, non-original sights, or sling swivels would not remove a firearm from its original condition. Moreover, we have determined that replacing particular firearms parts with new parts that are made to the original design would also be acceptable-for example, replacing a cracked M1 Grand stock with a new wooden stock of the same design, but replacing the original firearm stock with a plastic stock would change its classification as a C&R item.

 

[kalash]

So without a C&R I could have sporterized a Mosin but now I can't? That sounds silly.

I wonder if I'd be able to log it out of my book, since it wouldn't really be a milsurp collectible anymore.

 

[RTFM]

I think that if you modify it you can no longer transfer it as a C&R firearm.
https://www.atf.gov/firearms/faq/curios-relics.html

 

[DW357]

It is also the opinion of FTB, however, that a minor change such as the addition of scope mounts, non-original sights, or sling swivels would not remove a firearm from its original condition. Moreover, we have determined that replacing particular firearms parts with new parts that are made to the original design would also be acceptable-for example, replacing a cracked M1 Grand stock with a new wooden stock of the same design, but replacing the original firearm stock with a plastic stock would change its classification as a C&R item.

Someone needs to do some proofreading...

 

[exo]

So without a C&R I could have sporterized a Mosin but now I can't? That sounds silly.

I wonder if I'd be able to log it out of my book, since it wouldn't really be a milsurp collectible anymore.

I think that if you modify it you can no longer transfer it as a C&R firearm.
https://www.atf.gov/firearms/faq/curios-relics.html

C&R is just a status that grants the owner/possessor two exemptions, e.g. if you have a C&R FFL you are able to acquire firearms with C&R status interstate without going through a regular FFL. The other exemption would be from 922(r) compliance on certain imported firearms in original military configuration. If you modify such a firearm (remove the grenade launcher from a Yugo M59/66 SKS) it is no longer in its original configuration and thus now subject to 922r compliance. As modified it would no longer be C&R.

 

[SpencerT]

I'll be submitting my forms this week but had a question about "modifying" if I purchase a c&r item that needs refinishing does it need to be finished as original? Blued/nickeled or would I be able to say ceracote it?

thanks

 

[browncoat]

I'll be submitting my forms this week but had a question about "modifying" if I purchase a c&r item that needs refinishing does it need to be finished as original? Blued/nickeled or would I be able to say ceracote it?

thanks

By analogy with the "stock" example that the ATF gave above, I would assume that refinishing if done as originally would be considered a repair, application of a modern/unoriginal finish would possibly remove the C&R aspect. However, it seems to me that this would only matter for weapons that are C&R and less than 50 years old. If the receiver is over 50 years old, it should be C&R by virtue of age alone. Then again, nobody said the ATF has to make sense.

 

[tpm]

So without a C&R I could have sporterized a Mosin but now I can't? That sounds silly.

I wonder if I'd be able to log it out of my book, since it wouldn't really be a milsurp collectible anymore.

So you would have to log it out of you bound book, and transfer it to yourself then you could make the change?

 

[kalash]

So you would have to log it out of you bound book, and transfer it to yourself then you could make the change?

No transfer. I read somewhere that you simply log it out and basically list the reason/seller as "modifying" or something to that effect. Not sure if that's the right way to do it.

 

[Chevy 2 65]

What are they looking for with this question? I get the SSN but position?

Position and
Social
Security
Number